It's Official; Two Separate Troofer Fests in NY for 9-11

But they do kind of feature similar lineups. Sander Hicks' We Demand Transparency confab has Sunjata, Gage and Bermas; so does Luke's Real Change snoozer. The difference is that Hicks' event also has Steve Alten, Daniel Hopsicker, the CIT boys, Barrie Zwicker, Kevin Barrett and Mike Berger. The We Are Change crew are highlighting a few first responders; you know things are tough for Luke and company when they feature Manny Badillo as one of their headliners. The Chip-In Widget over there is now up to $110 with about three weeks to go.

9-11-09 Festivities

Continue to cause waves in the Troof community. Somebody noticed that now that Les and Luke are cooperating, We Are Change took down their post from February 2007, accusing Les of appropriating the money from the NYC 9-11 Truth accounts.

Les Jamieson has confiscated all funds related to NY911Truth. Les Jamison routed all donations totaling over $5,800 to his private bank account, confiscated DVD duplicators, estimated at about $1,000 and the film projector ,estimated $1,000 which was bought with donations.

There are two possibilities here. Either Luke took down the post as a show of unity with Les, or he took down the post because it's getting a little embarrassing now that Luke himself is being accused of financial irregularities.

Meanwhile, check out some of the entertainment:

On August 5, 2006, Supernatural attempted to set a new world record for the longest freestyle whilst hosting the Rock The Bells festival in San Bernardino, CA. Supernatural freestyled for over nine hours, breaking the original record of 8 hours 45 minutes set by D.O. of Canada, but not the 10 hours 34 minutes set by British emcee Ruffstylz in October 2003. The Current World Record is 16 Hours, set by Brooklyn DJ and lyricist/activist DJ Green Arrow. It should be noted that D.O. still holds the official record according to Guinness, not Supernat or Ruffstylz or DJ Green Arrow. DJ Green Arrow has pledged to officially break the Guinness Record, Sept. 12-13 at an event in NYC called the Real Change and Transparency conference. DJ Green Arrow has been training to rap for 48 Hours, thus quintupling the official record still held by D.O. and tripling his own record. DJ Green Arrow also is training to be able to break his world record every year, with money to benefit activist movements.

Yep, if you attend you could see the longest ever freestyle rap.

9-11 was an inside job
Orchestrated by the Cheney mob
and underwritten by a man named Bob
Who was quite a slob.

The towers came down in controlled demolition
Richard Gage demonstrates with boxes in position
He needs money so send it on condition
That he drops those boxes just like a magician!

Which Will Come First?

Richard Gage getting his 1000th Architect or Engineer, or the NYC Ballot Initiative getting its 100,000th signature?

Nearly 20,000 NYC voters have already signed the petition to create this public referendum. Many 9/11 family members, first responders, and peace organizations also support this campaign.

Remember, Les Jamieson's goal was to have 100,000 signatures by June 30.

We Now Return to "As The Truther World Turns"

The soap opera just got a little more operatic. Our commenter Patrick pointed out this mind-boggling discussion of the NYC Ballot Initiative fiasco waiting to happen over at Truth Action Forums. It's a delight, but I do have to wonder; don't these folks read Screw Loose Change? There is so much that we were pointing out months and years ago that suddenly seems blindingly obvious to the geniuses over there.

Much of the discussion is over whether Les Jamieson is a good person to be running the initiative, and as to whether he'd control the purse-strings of any commission. There is much moaning and gnashing of teeth, as if Jamieson's initiative had any chance of getting enough signatures to begin with, and then passing.

Les' split with the We Are Change boys comes up, and Arabesque is startled to hear that Luke Rudkowski and Tom Foti don't have any money to do their street actions. Of course, this was the case back in February 2007, when the missive he refers to was written.

Jon Gold checks in and says if you New York guys don't like Les, ease him out of the picture. Easier said than done, replies Albanese (which is true). So Gold writes an email to Jamieson suggesting that he step down in favor of somebody named Jules. But Jules demurs, saying he doesn't want the job. LOL! Gold's point is established; Les is only running the show because everybody else stepped backwards when they asked for volunteers.

My favorite comment may be this one, by somebody who attended one of the St. Mark's "organizational" meetings:

It's useful to read the different perspectives of this ballot initiative. I've been curious to what is really at work here. It sounds like a good idea, but there seems to be little support behind it. With a basic grasp of the background info, I went to the 9/11 Ballot Initiative meeting at St Marks last month to witness first hand the dynamic. It was strange. There were only about 70 people (attendees/organizers), and mostly very old. Several people spoke, but the actual plan was never discussed. Two older women helping were both German, maybe irrelevant, but interesting.

Paula Gloria and Webfairy were there. Paula got kicked out after bothering William Rodriguez while both were in the audience (asking him to be on her show). There was a big commotion about that lasting nearly 10 minutes. It almost seemed staged, but that's probably disinfo paranoia affecting my perspective. It's just that the doorman could have handled it better, it seemed like he was being louder than needed and not taking it outside right away.

Les seems robotic, like a droid. I know that is subjective, but it stood out. No charisma or genuine enthusiasm. The event had a sense of going thru the motions, but lacked a sense of purpose or spirit.

As we discussed, the split in New York was generational; hence all the young people are in WAC and all the older people are with Les.

The Chandler conference comes up again, and somebody (Albanese I think) makes the claim that Eric Williams released his book of Holocaust Denial "literally days" before the conference. Not true; for one thing, Stephen Lemons and I broke the story on February 1, 2007, three weeks before the conference. And I picked up the story two weeks before that. And the copyright date on Eric Williams' book was several months before that.

Jon Gold chips in that he threw Stephen Lemons out of the press conference; actually he made the suggestion that Stephen be thrown out, but it wasn't until hotel security arrived that he agreed to leave (and was allowed back in five minutes later by Phil Berg).

At any rate, it's a hilarious discussion. Great find, Patrick!

Moron the NYC Ballot Initiative

Mike Gravel, who finished eighth in a seven man field for the Democratic Presidential nomination, has picked up the cause.

The petition drive needs at least 30,000 residents to give their signatures in order to place a potential amendment to the city charter on the November ballot. The former Alaska senator and lifelong political loose cannon threw his weight behind the effort to establish a second, privately funded investigation into the events of September 11th, in response to what he called a fatally flawed 9/11 Commission report.

But get this:

Petition drive leaders say their efforts began in February, and thus far have gathered around 10,000 signatures in support of the ballot initiative.

Heheh. Over three weeks ago, I noted that Les Jamieson reported that they had 7,500 signatures, so they've only gotten 2,500 signatures since then. The newspaper article claims they have until September to get them but Jamieson's own page says otherwise:

Here's the plan. We must get 30,000 valid petition signatures of registered New York City voters as quickly as possible. To ensure we reach this goal, we are aiming for 100,000 signatures. Our target date is June 30th. At that time our petition will be reviewed by New York City Council. On July 1st we'll begin gathering another 15,000 signatures which will override City Council if they decide to reject our proposal.

Wow, they were aiming for 100,000 signatures and they're less than two weeks away from their own target date, and they've got 1/10th of what they need? Even if we assume the September deadline is correct, they aren't going to get there. They might have a shot at September 2010 at the rate they're going.

Oh, and even if they get the proposition on the ballot and it passes, there's still another hurdle:

The commission would rely on private financing, with a budget of $10 million a year.

Look these dorks can't even hire some signature-gatherers. Where in the world do they think they're going to come up with $10 million a year?

This will be what, the 27th consecutive fiasco for the 9-11 "Truthers"? It's Truth Week, Truth Burn, Final Cut and Jones' ridiculous peer-reviewed paper all over again.

Les Jamieson Making Promises He Can't Keep?

Les is apparently caught up in the NYC ballot initiative, which the Troofers, in their usual inimitable style, are going to screw up royally. They apparently need 30,000 valid signatures by June 30 to get the petition reviewed by the NY City Council, but in order to be sure they are aiming for 100,000 signatures so that any rejects don't cost them their place on the ballot. Of course, this is going to be a little tough, considering that so far they have 7500 signatures. DOH!

There will be a rally for the ballot initiative at St. Mark's Church, which is where the NY Truthers hold their regular meetings. But Les claims that John Feal is scheduled to be one of the speakers, and as you can see in the right sidebar at that site, he is listed. Quoting from an email Jamieson sent out:

Featured speakers include:

Wayne Madsen, investigative reporter, retired NSA analyst
John Feal, 9/11 first responder, Director of the Feal Good Foundation
William Rodriguez, 9/11 hero and last survivor of WTC1
Sander Hicks, 9/11 author/researcher, founder of Voxpop.net
Jesse Richard, founder of TVNewsLies.org
Karen Johnson, state senator from Arizona (by phone)

One problem. Nobody apparently told John Feal. Quoting from a private email:

I contacted Feal and he said he will not be speaking: that they contacted him, he didn't reply, and they added his name without permission. Scumbags.

Indeed. Kudos to the Gravy Meister, Mark Roberts, who despite reports to the contrary has not dropped out of the debunking community.

Troof Pays

I constantly find it amusing how troofers consider themselves a sort of modern day superhero, Dylan Avery after all compared himself to Rosa Parks, Simon Wiesenthal, Winston Churchill, and Nelson Mandela, but yet it always seems to come down to money. This is from an e-mail forwarded from Les Jamieson, of NYC 911 Truth:

Hello all,

PETITIONING

We have had some good outings over the past month. We have people working independently in Queens and Staten Island. Also, we have some new banners which we tested out last week and were very effective. See photos here - http://www.nyc911initiative.org/petitioning.htm.

The first 3 people who come forward with 100 signatures for March will receive a $50 gift certificate from Barnes & Nobles. Same for April! Also, the first 3 people to recruit 10 active volunteers will receive the same. We should all be reaching out to appeal to all concerned citizens to help with this historic campaign over the next few months.

Geez, I know people who will work hours a week for free, publicly campaigning to get a library remodeled. These guys think they are saving the world from impending fascism, yet they need financial incentives to put their heart into it. How pathetic.

Les "Urantia" Jamieson Group Lists Its Speakers

It looks like there will be two separate sets of kooks active in NYC around the 9-11 anniversary; the We Are Changers led by Luke Rudkowski and the NY 9-11 group led by Les "Urantia" Jamieson. The latter group has a predictable mix of aging 1960s radicals like Ralph Schoeneman and 9-11 Crackpots like Uncle Fetzer and Kevin "Air Quotes" Barrett, with Webster "LaRouchee" Tarpley and Richard "Gaga" Gage thrown in to provide the intellectual weight. About the only surprise on the list is Craig "Lloyd England is an accomplice" Ranke; with the Changers having the world premiere of Loose Change the Final Cut the Rough Cut, I guess Jamieson felt he needed a world famous filmmaker as well. Too bad he couldn't find one.

Jamieson Group Brings Out the Kooks

Here's a pretty amusing little article on Les Jamieson's latest event at St. Marks.

April Fools’ Day fell this spring on Palm Sunday and it was a solemn occasion at St. Mark’s Church in the Bowery. There, after Sunday services, some 300 apparent true believers packed the sanctuary in the early afternoon and heard politically charged conspiracy theories surrounding the fall of the World Trade Center five-and-a-half years ago.

Ralph Schoenman, the militant left-wing co-host of WBAI radio’s “Taking Aim” program, was the draw for the varied crowd of aging beatniks, East Village couples and singletons and assorted punk anarchists and antiwar activists in black T-shirts. They paid $8 apiece to be told that the tragic events of that day represented an “inside job” and “terror at the top” of the U.S. government.

And guess who introduced Schoenman?

He was introduced by Downtown radical lawyer Lynne Stewart, out on bail while appealing a 2005 conviction for aiding a violent Islamic group on behalf of her convicted terrorist client, Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman, a blind and diabetic Egyptian cleric. She embraced Schoenman and referred to him in biblical terms as “Our Jeremiah.” He, in turn, said Stewart was among the government targets “who spoke the truth about 9/11 and then were deprived” of their liberty.

Yep, they managed to get one of the few American citizens convicted of aiding and abetting terrorists! Of course, the rest of the movement is trying to do the same thing.

NY Denier Wars Continue

Apparently the rumors of Les Jamieson's demise as leader of the NY Denier Group were a tad premature. Nico writes:

At the latest Jamieson/Morales St marks event Luke Rudkowski and Tom Foti, who have hosted the majority of recent NY911T events at St Mark's church in recent years, as well as myself, one of the groups most dedicated activists, were not allowed into the recent St. Mark's church Les Jamieson/Frank Morales event.

After having done a great deal of work for NY911T and hosting the most recent events there aside from Les Jamieson's 'who killed the electric car?' presentation, they have refused to talk to any of us.

Frank came outside to smoke a cigarette and Luke went to talk to him but got nowhere and he quickly went in when I came around.

While Les couldn't speak, his friend Elaine spoke for him, arguing that "he didnt lie!!! he forgot about urantia!! hes been so busy with 911!" when i brought up the fact that he was a member since 1972 and he logged into urantia book readers online network spreading 911 truth in 2005 (see 2nd page of comments)...

NY Denier Group Fracture Continues

Yesterday's birthday party for Rosie O'Donnell may have marked the changing of the guard at the NY Denier group. Luke Rudkowski got on the phone with Alex Jones and claimed that Rosie was going to address the Deniers, but of course that never happened.

Over at 9-11 Blogger, there are comments from John Albanese indicating that Les Jamieson has finally gotten the axe over the URANTIA connection. The idea that Tom "How many of you here have heard of the Federal Reserve?" Foti is now leading the NY group amuses me greatly. Granted, it's probably better that they aren't being run by a cultist, but it's also really the difference between Tweedledum and Tweedleduh. Here's what Albanese had to say:

It appears that Tom Foti is the new organizer in NYC since Les Jamieson was deposed.

As some of you may remember Nico Haupt was video-taped disrupting an event at St Marks church in NYC. Many people who viewed that tape asked why Tom Foto (sic) appeared to be enabling and appeasing Haupt during that incident - as opposed to simply asking him to leave (once the obscenities started to fly).

Mr Jamieson and Father Frank Morales have now both publicly stated that they view Tom Foti as part of an organized disruption campaign - as well as claiming that Foti appears to be working in concert with Haupt.

Meanwhile, Rudkowski has broken some news over at a new blog.

I feel extremely reluctant to discuss the current situation with NY 9/11 Truth, but it needs to be addressed if we are going to move forward in this movement. This situation has been extremely divisive, and I hope we can all come to a resolution in a civil and honest manner. It should be known that I've tried to deal with this in an private setting, hoping to shield the rest of the movement from this unnecessary drama. However, Les Jamison has put me in a position where that is no longer possible. It should be also noted that Les Jamison that over the past few months, the following has occurred:

1. Les Jamison with out any reason took me (Luke Rudkowski) off the main NY911Truth list serve, preventing me from emailing the 1,093 members of NY911Truth with updates and announcements related to upcoming events. Les Jamison also publicly stated that I, Luke Rudkowski, have started my own organization, which he sees as a separate entity from NY911Truth. This is false. I started the CHANGE organization in the hopes that it would represent the younger members of NY 9/11 Truth and offer them an outlet they otherwise may not have. Les Jamison owns 100% of the NY 9/11 Truth web site and the e mail list. In fact.all donations to NY911Truth go through Les Jamison’s private bank account. It should be noted I recently planned a big event to support show support for Rosie O'Donnell. But I wasn't able to get the word out effectively, because I found myself locked out of the e-mail account. This only hurts the movement.

2. Les Jamison has confiscated all funds related to NY911Truth. Les Jamison routed all donations totaling over $5,800 to his private bank account, confiscated DVD duplicators, estimated at about $1,000 and the film projector ,estimated $1,000 which was bought with donations.

Note in particular that although the group claims over 1,000 members, only about 15 show up at the regular meetings.

More Doings at the NY Deniers Group

This stuff is rather amusing to me, but may be a little too "inside baseball" for general interest.

When the topic did come up, you answered the question and according to your previous email "I told you last spring after answering your questions about Urantia to free to ask again if any new questions pop up." In light of the barrage of Urantia emails from Nico, Tom brought up some more questions about the topic at a recent Wednesday night meeting, as you had previously welcomed.You clearly said to the entire group 1. you never had any position of authority in Urantia and were "only a reader" and 2. you have not been involved with Urantia since '99, when you went to South Africa to to be of just a few Urantia representatives at the 'Parliament of World Religions'. But of course we all knew this because of the emails we got from Nico.

I later spoke with Tom after that meeting, and we began talking about the questions that he had asked, and the answers that you, Les, gave. Very nonchalantly, I said to Tom "you do know he lying right" because, like I said, I researched this issue and found these links that prove that you lied to the group at the Wednesday meeting

Les, I don't know if you are CIA, COINTELPRO, or what, but it is very clear that right now you are doing more to hurt the movement than anyone else.

- Ryan Rodrigues

It is quite apparent that the infighting in the New York Deniers group will continue until morale improves.

More Urantia

Now some of the anti-Nico folks at the NY 9-11 Denier group have taken up the issue.

Well here it goes. This is what is going on:
1. Les Jamison has called and emailed leaders and members of national 9/11 truth movements saying I, Luke Rudkowski, and Tom Foti are infiltrators. This is because Tom has asked Les a question about his involvement in Urantia. Which he publicly lied to the group about. It should be noted, I had to find from people all over the country about Les' attempt to slander me.

All Tom did was write an email about our public meeting where we established a public policy, and suggested that you accept the invitation for a televised discussion about questions regarding your religious associations.