Neo-Nazis Posting at Looser Forum
Just had this brought to my attention by our buddies at JREF. Turns out that Rei Kurasame, a regular poster at the Looser Board, found out about my blasting them for their Holocaust Revisionism a week or so ago.
So she (I assume) posts some backup for some of the claims she made about the rapes US and Russian troops committed in Nazi Germany. Now, let me stipulate that I am sure that evil things were done by individual American troops and Russian troops, perhaps sometimes even by groups of American troops and Russian troops. But systemic, with approval from the top? I don't buy it.
And look who she helpfully cites with each reported war crime:
- Kevin Alfred Strom, based on Dr. Austin J. App's book: "Ravishing the women of conquered Europe"
Okay, so let's do a little Googling. Kevin Alfred Strom? Here's his Wikipedia entry:
Kevin Alfred Strom (born 1956 in Anchorage, Alaska) is the Managing Director of National Vanguard, an organization based in Charlottesville, Virginia. It is regarded by some as being racist, white separatist, homophobic and a Neo-Nazi hate group. Mr. Strom and the organization dispute this characterization, however, saying that it is completely legitimate for men and women of European descent to organize to promote their interests as a people. National Vanguard states on its website that the USA would be improved "if it becomes a proud White nation again". Its membership rules stipulate that "Persons of Jewish descent, homosexuals or bisexuals, criminals, persons with a non-White spouse or sexual partner, or persons with more than an undetectable trace of non-White ancestry are specifically barred from membership."
So, Rei Kurasame gets her information from a white separatist kook? How about the author cited, Dr. Austin J. App? Turns out he's a seminal figure in Holocaust Revisionism, cited by our old friend, Willis Carto.
Better still, Do-Over Dylan commends Rei for her post:
rei, while you clearly won this no question, it's right up there with me apologizing for the jack blood bernard brown and boxcutters episode. they don't dare post something counter-intuitive to their idea of us all as stark raving lunatics with no remorse or critical thinking skills.
Well, you know, Dylan, if you weren't foolish enough to commend a Holocaust Revisionist citing Holocaust Revisionist sources, we might actually give you a little credit for your critical thinking skills. As it is, you did, so we won't.
Dylan chimes in again later, after the Holocaust Revisionism of Rei's sources have been pointed out, but he's only interest in chiding us and Gravy:
SLC and Mark Roberts et al are some of the biggest hypocrites I've ever encountered.
They crucify us for actions that they constantly participate in, without a thought.
Prime example. Mark Roberts calling a truther at Ground Zero an *sshole, repeatedly. If any of us did that, regardless of the incentive, he'd have a video up on Youtube the next day hi-lighting the fact that we called him an *sshole.
Feel free to call me a blankety-blank any time you want Dylan. It doesn't bother me at all. Mark was a little more "in your face" with that Denier than I'd be, but I'm not him, and I wasn't there to see the whole exchange.
Later still, Dylan tries the Uriah Heep routine:
I'm one of the most humble people you'll ever meet.
He has plenty to be humble about.
posted by Pat @ 5:23 PM
58 comments
58 Comments:
I'm one of the most humble people you'll ever meet.
Reminds me of an old family joke:
"I'm so smart."
"Modest, too."
they don't dare post something counter-intuitive to their idea of us all as stark raving lunatics with no remorse or critical thinking skills.
Uh we can't post something that isn't true.
"I'm one of the most humble people you'll ever meet."
Did he call Gravy a hypocrite? Does he even know what it means?
Meanwhile, back to The Nation article, a revealing post. In response to this article in the Nation, a poster on 911Blogger.com wrote:(emphasis mine)
"I feel a duty to respond
"To the editorial staff of "The Nation":
"Here's what I don't understand. It's bad enough that you are clearly not advocates of 9/11 Truth... but why do self-professed gatekeepers (like the Nation) feel the need to attack the 9/11 Truth Movement? Why not just shut-up about it? What do you possibly hope to gain by going after us? Especially considering that we ARE RIGHT... and you are soooo very WRONG."
Shut up about the paranoia of the 9/11 Truth Movement? Looks like that truther does not want the truth revealed.
______________________
Professional psychological assessment of the 9/11 Truth Movement: "Minds on vacation, mouths working overtime."
(With apologies to Mose Allison)
Rei is back defending herself over at the SLC forums.
She seems to think the Allies and the Axis were equals in terms of morals.
Is "Rei Kurasame" (is that a real name?) in Iran right now, attending the Ahmadinejad "The Holocaust is a Myth" Conference?
BTW, here's hoping someone throws a large can of Zyklon-B into that meeting, to give the "attendees" a bit of what the jews were put through.
So now we are at the level of denying of the rape of many German women at the end of WWII?
Did you even read the post?
Disclaimer: I am not a holocause denier but have looked at both sides of the issue.
Question:
James and or PatDr. Austin J. App? Turns out he's a seminal figure in Holocaust Revisionism, cited by our old friend, Willis Carto.
Did you find out where any of this originally came from? Not the person mind you but the particular information? War reports? Eyewitness accounts, etc? It is fine to attack the person for their beliefs, in fact it is expected on this blog, but I'm curious where the original information came from.
One other question, why doesn't the memmoirs of Churchill, FDR, Eisenhower, or the Red Cross reports mention anything about a holocause of jews in Europe? I've always found that rather odd to be honest. Also I think the official 6 million figure has been revised down to 3 million I was sure if I read that from the Holocaust Museum in DC or the Aushwitz tour guides.
Happy Monday everyone!
So now not only does swinger believe in the 9/11 CT, the Oklahoma City CT, and the Pearl Harbour CT....he's also a holocaust revisionist. Great. As if he didn't look retarded enough before.
One other question, why doesn't the memmoirs of Churchill, FDR, Eisenhower, or the Red Cross reports mention anything about a holocause of jews in Europe? I've always found that rather odd to be honest.
I don't think you find it odd at all. In fact I don't think you personally know it to be true. It's just something you picked up from one of the various Holocaust denier sites out there and decided to repeat. I am wholly unsurprised at this development. Burn in hell with stomach cancer, scum.
I hope this support for nazis and holocaust deniers is put on a screenshot for the hardfire interview.
I know the following is distantly related to 9/11, WWII, etc, but think it's worthy of mention.
Promotions, pay rises honours - how the key players in the Kelly scandal were rewarded
Well actually I did read the Red Cross report, Manny. But alas, I haven't read the other two Tomes completely.
And Manny, may karma visit your family with the same well wishes you visited upon me. (If you haven't paid attention, Pat has asked us to refrain from personal attacks.)
And Alex, don't you have something Canadian to do for your country? And no I'm not a revisionist.
Well actually I did read the Red Cross report, Manny.
I don't believe you. Which report?
I don't believe you. Which report?
Ok. Why do you ask? You don't believe me.
Ok. Why do you ask?
In order to expose you as the lying sack of garbage neo-Nazi terrorist supporter you are. It is literally impossible to come across an ICRC report about the Nazis during World War II without being informed about the organization's actions subsequent to the war and how it came to be silent while events were contemporary. Can't be done. So there are literally no observers who find it "odd." None. Not a single person who has looked into the subject on even a cursory basis is unaware of their explanation or has to ask why. No one.
In order to expose you as the lying sack of garbage neo-Nazi terrorist supporter you are.
Do you still molest little children, Manny?
Yup, the CT mindset comes out once again.
A few rapes of women by horny teenage soldiers, repugnant as they may be, morally equals the wholesale incarceration, torture, and industrialized murder of 10-12 million people, 6 million of which were jews.
Sure, the two cancel each other out.
That's what I thought, Swing. You didn't read any Red Cross reports either. You just spouted out some crap you read on a neo-Nazi site and thought no one would call you out on it.
Wrong again, Mr. Child Molestor.
Answer the question, Manny! Do you still molest little children?
And what does it matter, oh one who molests children. You wouldn't believe me anyway.
Seems like Manny stopped molesting children after he got done with you Swing.
Child molestor and others: as I've stated before, I'm not a holocaust revisionist or denier. But as a common childish act, some try to link 9/11 ct's with such rable in order to try to discredit them. Which of course will not work at this particular time with this particular individual. At no where in this post did I deny the holocaust.
According to the Toronto Sun article , headline Poland Lowers Aushwitz Toll, lowering the number from 4 million killed to 1.3 million.
That is why I brought up the 6 million number.
Manny, are you going to answer my question?
And yes I'm also aware that the leader of the ICRC appologized for the Cross's silence during the holocaust.
Now the conspiracy becomes: Why was the ICRC silent about the holocaust? Why did the ICRC lie about and fabricate a report, going as far as to fake a report about the Jewish conditions in the camps they investigated.
OK guys, I know this is an emotional subject, but try and keep it civil, or I will have to make you all stand in the corner.
I really think it's time to ban this idiot. His argument has now broken down to "questioning" the holocaust, accusing people of being child molesters, and making fun of canadians. He has nothing informative, intelligent, or in the least bit relevant to add to this site. He is, in other words, a waste of oxygen, and in this medium a waste of storage, bandwidth, and electrons. Pulling the plug on him would be an act of mercy.
OK guys, I know this is an emotional subject, but try and keep it civil, or I will have to make you all stand in the corner.
I read your latest admonition to proscribe profanity only, based on Pat's comments in the thread. If you also want me to stop using subjective perjorative terms like scum or sack of garbage, of course I will. However, I will not cease calling persons who lie while attempting to aid terrorists and deny the Holocaust lying terrorist-supporting Holocaust deniers. It is factually correct and backed by posts in this very blog.
Alex, wasn't it you several posts ago that stated people should see me about sucking dick?
Alex, I don't make fun of Canadians, only you. You happen to be Candian. I've never made fun of TAM, he is Canadian.
I only reflect that which you visit upon me. You have done nothing but attack my person and my character many times when addressing my posts.
And again Alex, your buddy proved you a liar on the other post.
In the Clakity Clak post, I just posted something factual, you countered said it was a wrong, and Manny proved that you were the liar. So really perhaps you should stick to what you know, which up to this point isn't much but Canadian history and Canadian current events.
Manny, put your typing where your thoughts are and prove the following:
1. attempting to aid terrorists?
What do you have?
(I've accused terrorists of using explosives in the 9/11 attacks at the WTC complex.)
In fact, perhaps you are aiding the terrorists by not supporting an investigation into explosives at the WTC complex. By not investigating it, we have no idea how to improve designs or security against another attack. Is that want you want, Manny?
2.deny the Holocaust
(a lie Manny)
What you have from me:(My post earlier-Disclaimer: I am not a holocause denier but have looked at both sides of the issue. One other question, why doesn't the memmoirs of Churchill, FDR, Eisenhower, or the Red Cross reports mention anything about a holocause of jews in Europe?)
Explain to me the 'denial' in that question? Nevermind, you can't.
You will only insert assumptions into my question to try to vaidate your lie. "He asks that so we assume he is a HD. Sorry it won't work."
3.lying terrorist-supporting Holocaust deniers.
Again,what do you have?
4. It is factually correct and backed by posts in this very blog.
(a lie-at what point did I deny the holocaust? )
5. Now because you and Alex have just been proven to be liars, is it fair game to call you terrorists supporters and HD's as well? I didn't think so.
Alex and Manny move on. You have nothing more to address in this particular post.
OK guys, I know this is an emotional subject, but try and keep it civil, or I will have to make you all stand in the corner.
I tried James, but you can see where your problem began this time: in order to expose you as the lying sack of garbage neo-Nazi terrorist supporter you are.
BG is correct. That is all you OS'ers do isn't it? (Sorry to those of you that don't if you fall under the OS category.)
Swing:
I am Canadian. I am a proud Canadian. Canadians died on 9/11 also.
I agree that name calling, on both sides, to the degree it has occured in this thread, is uncalled for, and should be stopped. It is one thing to call someone an idiot or asshole, but child molestor and neo-nazi terrorist is just un-needed.
TAM
Tam, I know your Canadian. That is why I mentioned you in my post. And I agree with you totally. I had to pull the karma cord with Manny.
Swing Dangler,
I appreciate your frustration.
I'm no expert about how to make our comments work toward truth and justice, but...
keep your emotional distance from the flame throwers, if you can.
I happened to visit Pat's "Brainiac" blog. It offered another example of the political beliefs of many of those behind this blog.
They are so off-the-graph from reality that we empower them by taking up many of their fake (or extremely misguided) debates.
Maybe I'm not being logical but when it comes to the numbers, who cares? It doesn't matter if it was 6 or 1.5 million, it was still an organized systematic killing of innocent people. The Nazis represented the absolute worst part of humanity. Why argue about it? Either your a neo-nazi, anti-semetic, or just confrontational. Those are all bad in my book.
They are so off-the-graph from reality that we empower them by taking up many of their fake (or extremely misguided) debates.
Sorry for generalizing but basically you guys are
A)Downplaying how bad the Nazis were
B)Shifting the blame from terrorists to our government for 9/11
How is this off-the-graph from reality? How can you people even sleep at night? America may have its problems but it will never EVER be as bad as terrorists and nazis. If you think otherwise your just plain stupid. I don't even consider that an ad hominem. I really can't think of any better way to describe your behavior than just simply stupid.
It doesn't matter if it was 6 or 1.5 million,
It kind of does.
The 1.3 million number comes from the updating of a plaque at Auschwitz. The plaque at one time read that 4 million were killed there, but was lowered to 1.3 million. AT AUSCHWITZ, and the 6 million number takes that in to account. There were 10 extermination camps killing millions, and and 40 or so other camps where hundreds of thousands died, not in gas chambers but by firing squads, medical experiments, starvation, whim, etc., not to mention the ghettos and the death squads. Lots of deniers don't even know there were camps other than Auschwitz, and they usually don't even know what country it was in.
When deniers say something like well, it was only 1.4 million at Auschwitz, they are actively denying all of the other terrors and atrocities that the nazis perpetrated. It's flat denial. Auschwitz was only a part of the nazis horror.
It does tell you something when they do say something like "it was ONLY 1.4 million people killed".
Disgusting.
The 1.3 million number comes from the updating of a plaque at Auschwitz.
And lest anyone think that Swing Dangler was "just wondering" when he "asked" about the accepted number of murders and referenced the "Toronto Sun article," that article was written 16 years ago. He didn't just happen across the thing on Google News and it piqued his curiosity. He read it on a Holocaust denial site and consciously decided to spread it in hopes of causing other people to "just wonder."
Macbeth visits the Holy Land: Zionists with 60 years of blood on their hands?
Put a sock in it Bill. Nobody follows your useless links unless they're bored and looking for amusement.
People who are "bored and looking for amusement."
Thanks for following my links.
AHA! You get paid every time one of them clicks a link, right? THAT'S why you're THANKING THEM! I KNEW IT! YOU'RE A SHILL!
When deniers say something like well, it was only 1.4 million at Auschwitz, they are actively denying all of the other terrors and atrocities that the nazis perpetrated. It's flat denial. Auschwitz was only a part of the nazis horror.
It does tell you something when they do say something like "it was ONLY 1.4 million people killed".
Disgusting.
I agree. The point that I was trying to make was reguardless of the number its still terrible. I just can't see how in their minds once you get to a certain number it's "ok."
According to the Toronto Sun article , headline Poland Lowers Aushwitz Toll, lowering the number from 4 million killed to 1.3 million.
It's actually about 1.1 million, but because you haven't studied the Second World War as I have, you wouldn't know that the "four million" at Auschwitz never figured into the total death figures of the Holocaust.
I just can't see how in their minds once you get to a certain number it's "ok."
They're trying to use an old sales technique called reduction to the ridiculous. Believe me, if you've ever made a really major purchase, you've seen it.
It goes something like this:
You: That is sure a nice TV, but $5000 is just too expensive
Salesman: Well, This TV will last you 10 years, so if you divide the $5000 cost over 10 years, its only $500/year.
You: But I don't want to spend $500/year.
Salesman: Well, really, its only $1.30 a day, and you'll watch it an average of 4 hours a day, its less than $0.35/hr, thats not even a penny per minute to have a great TV like this in your home.
You: Yeah, but...
Salesman: Isn't your happiness worth less than a penny a minute?
You: Yeah, I guess.
So thats what they do, but in a slightly different way. They cut the numbers, from 6 million to 1 million, then they cut it down more and more, eventually claiming there were actually more jews after the holocaust than before it, so it wasn't a big deal. It gets to the "Its OK" number pretty easily in their minds.
DON'T LET THEM. Denying even one death attributed to the nazis is disgusting.
I was listening to NPR today and they were talking about how Iran is having a conference on whether the Holocaust happened.
Next week's conference? On whether water is wet.
Wouldn't it be horrible if, halfway through the Iranian conference, a cruise missile were to accidentally go off course in the same general direction as the convention hall? Gee, I'd sure hate for that to happen.
So....I hear the Eisenhower Strike Group is in the area....
Wouldn't it be horrible if, halfway through the Iranian conference, a cruise missile were to accidentally go off course in the same general direction as the convention hall? Gee, I'd sure hate for that to happen.
Better hope Rei doesn't see that.
Better hope Rei doesn't see that.
Yeah, she might duck out early.
Hey, it isn't every day you can hear David Duke speak.
That photo looks like something from somethingawful's Photoshop Phriday.
bg:
when you post a link, I can put my mouse pointer over it, and see where the link is going to.
If you want myself, or anyone here really, to actually go to your links, why dont you start posting links to LEGITIMATE, NON-CTer SITES for a change?
TAM
Love the headline:
"Holocaust Deniers and Skeptics Gather in Iran"
I can guarentee there were no skeptics there.
BG Good point brother. I fell into their trap! ;)
And lest anyone think that Swing Dangler was "just wondering" when he "asked" about the accepted number of murders and referenced the "Toronto Sun article," that article was written 16 years ago. He didn't just happen across the thing on Google News and it piqued his curiosity. He read it on a Holocaust denial site and consciously decided to spread it in hopes of causing other people to "just wonder."
Again Manny, you show your lack of knowledge regarding the subject. I have a co-worker who is going back to school for a second degree. He is doing a paper on the Holocaust. He sent me scan of the particular newspaper to ask me what I thought of it. And to be honest, until my friend had sent me the article, I had no idea that the number had been changed; that was the first I had ever heard of that number. So again, Manny, stick to what you know, not what you think you know.
And yes, the event is a tragedy there is no question about that. Something of that nature is never ok. But for the sake of history, it would be nice to have a historical consenus on the facts.
Shawn Have you studied who funded the Nazi party in Germany prior to WW 2?
Democrat, isn't that the truth!
Now, let me stipulate that I am sure that evil things were done by individual American troops and Russian troops, perhaps sometimes even by groups of American troops and Russian troops. But systemic, with approval from the top? I don't buy it.
In the case of American soldiers, I agree that rape was neither systematic nor approved of.
However, there is little controversy among historians that the Russians encouraged their soldiers to rape their way into Germany, as vengeance for German atrocities earlier in the war.
Don't mean to derail the other discussions going on here, but that needed saying.
I've never heard that particular allegation before, but considering all the things the Ruskies did both previous and subsequent to WW2, this wouldn't surprise me in the least. East Germany wasn't exactly the epitome of modern civilization after the war either.
jpslovjansky,
I wasn't aware that the claim that Ehrenburg officially incited rapes had been seriously questioned. Gosh, who to believe: Goebbels or Ehrenburg? Both were consummate propagandists, e.g., state-sanctioned liars.
Cornelius Ryan seemed to have little doubt that enormous numbers of rapes were committed at the time Berlin fell. He's not the only one. Ryan does mention the Ehrenberg story, but his evidence of widespread rape is independent of his conclusions on why it occurred.
Could the Berlin rapes have been widespread but not officially or even unofficially sanctioned? I am skeptical, but open to any evidence you have that the Russian leadership tried to stop them. For what it's worth (perhaps not much) I vaguely recall reading a quote from a Russian general to the effect that a soldier who had fought the Fascists all the way from Moscow to Berlin was entitled to a little fun.
I think your disagreement comes down to semantics. Your definition of "sanctioned" is "failed to oppose", whereas JP's definition is "actively encouraged". At least, that's the way it seems to me. I doubt that Russian leaders gave official orders for their men to start raping German women. On the other hand, I also doubt that the leaders on the ground (ie. military officers) did anything to stop or discourage it, and, knowing Slavic armies the way I do, they may very well have encouraged it in some units. It certainly wouldn't be the last time that something like that happened - you can read up on the conduct of some Serb military units in the 90's Balkans war for a more recent example of rape being actively encouraged at lower levels. Not that this sort of behaviour is exclusive to east-european armies by any means...but it's a LOT less prevalent amongst western forces.
I tried to get into it with the Nazi chick on there after mentioning exactly who she was quoting in the hopes that maybe someone would sorta take a step back and realize common sense.....
I think I quit after 2 or 3 posts because there wasn't much to say that was gonna make her realize that quoting from a guy who's made it his life's mission to lie about the events in Europe during the 1940s might not be the most credible source for info on Europe in the 1940s.....
Heh, I don't think that's what he meant when he said that he "tried to get into it".
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