Saturday, January 20, 2007

Daniel Hopsicker Hanging Out With David Irving

Turns out that Hopsicker was a featured speaker at a "Real History, USA" conference hosted by Holocaust Revisionist Supreme, David Irving. Michael Ruppert of From the Wilderness was scheduled to speak at this conference, but apparently came to his senses in time.

I'm reading Hopsicker's Welcome to Terrorland right now; you can read it here. It relies heavily on Amanda Keller, who has admitted that she was not Atta's girlfriend. And the FBI agrees:

But the former Venice stripper now says her boyfriend was another flight student not connected to 9/11. And, for the first time, federal investigators say she's right.

"There's nothing there to corroborate the relationship between the two," a New York-based FBI counterterrorism agent said recently after reviewing 9/11 case files.


Of course, to conspiracy theorists, that's just evidence that the FBI is in on the plot. But to the rest of us, it says that the relationship was looked into by the FBI and they concluded it was a bunch of BS.

As I read the book, I see lots of evidence that the Mohammed that Amanda was dating was not Atta. For example, in Chapter Five:

Mohamed had used a check to bail her out of jail, Amanda will tell us. She knew him as Mohamed Arajaki, which was also the name on the check. "The FBI told me they found bank accounts of his all over in numerous different names," Keller stated.


And I suspect that this is the book's central trick. Hopsicker assumes Atta is Arajaki, and therefore, when his witnesses call him Mohamed he dutifully quotes them, but then adds some side commentary about how "Atta sure doesn't sound like a devout Muslim to me!"

For example:

"The two girls were introduced to two men from Germany that they said were Mohamed's friends," Tony LaConca continued. "I thought it was strange, because Mohamed didn't appear to be French-Canadian or German."

Atta was meeting "two men from Germany" in Key West, who we will later learn flew in solely to meet him. This is the first hint we have gotten that all of Mohamed Atta's associates don't face East five times every day.


People who refer to him as Atta associated with Amanda Keller:

Stephanie Fredrickson, neighbor:
"Amanda said to me, 'I'd like you to meet my friend Mohamed Atta. He's from France.' I looked at her to see if she was joking, but I guess she wasn't," stated Frederickson.


Fredrickson refers to him as Atta several times. But what about the point up above about how Amanda "knew him as Mohamed Arajaki"? See the problem?

Apartment Manager Charlie Grapentine:
"Atta always carried a fanny pack around his waist," Grapentine said. "I remember Amanda once telling him that she needed some new clothes, and he reached in and peeled off a few hundreds from a thick roll of cash he had stuffed inside the fanny pack."

The FBI did not receive apartment manager Grapentine's recollections any more warmly than they had those of Stephanie Frederickson.


In fact, says Grapentine, the FBI was positively frosty, especially on the subject of talking to reporters.

"They called me a liar, and told me to keep my mouth shut," states the ex-marine grimly. "Nobody likes to hear that; that they didn't see something they know they saw."

There's also quite a bit of evidence of BS in Amanda's tale as well. For example, she claims:

"I helped him move from a house in North Port, and he asked me to talk to the landlady, because he didn't like American women, and she (Vonnie) happened to be the one renting the apartment," Amanda said.

"'How can you like me if you don't like American women?' I asked him. 'I'm as American as it gets!"'

Mohamed replied that he didn't 'translate' well with American women.

"So I talked to the landlady for him," Amanda said. "He was curt and rude with her, so she told him when it was time to pay the rent just to stick it (the check) in the freezer, so she wouldn't have to deal with him."


Stick the check in the freezer? Wouldn't it be simpler and involve less interaction with Mohammed to say "Stick the check in the mail?" Would a terrorist agree to an arrangement where his landlady could come into his apartment pick up the check? It doesn't pass the reasonability test. It's a nonsense story, unless of course the boyfriend was not a terrorist. Even then it sounds dubious. Do landladies often rent to people who are curt and rude with them?

I haven't finished the book, so these are preliminary impressions.

32 Comments:

At 20 January, 2007 12:47, Blogger Triterope said...

Of all the ways the CTs try to prove a 9/11 conspiracy, the Amanda Keller story has got to be the most pointless. What is any of this supposed to prove?

 
At 20 January, 2007 12:54, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thanks for covering, Pat.

 
At 20 January, 2007 13:02, Blogger The Artistic Macrophage said...

Hopsicker is a godamn nutcase if ever there was one. He clearly has an agenda, and rarely lets facts and evidence get in the way of that agenda.

TAM

 
At 20 January, 2007 13:29, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I would really love to be a fly on the wall at a "truth" party. Could you imagine Dylan Avery rubbing elbows with Nazi sympathizers? Right now there is someone posting at the LC forums as Fidel Castro. Im sure the real Castro would get an invite as long as he was a truther. Strange bedfellows. They are so desperate for publicity, maybe they should throw a party; it's definitely a man bites dog story.

 
At 20 January, 2007 14:32, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Will try to keep this short;

I'm well aware that I'm considered part of the group (truthers) that you are find worthy of complete derision.

I'm not trying to change the subject or disrupt this blog. For those here (like Troy) who follow RBN, GCN, and Alex Jones will enjoy this audio summary:
John Stadtmiller - Alex Jones

I'm making this comment with this link, because I'll want to follow up on it on future comments.

 
At 20 January, 2007 18:41, Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.911bloglines.com/node/22
Peters/Floum Clan continues to ban and censor at 911blogger.com

Peters/Floum Clan continues to ban and censor at 911blogger.com
by 911bloglines.com
January 18, 2007
(see also http://www.911blogger.com/node/5658
http://www.911blogger.com/comment/reply/5658/109559)

UPDATE 01/20:
More lies from dz aka Roger Peters

...
Peters continues to lie, censor, doublethink and doublespeak!
He continues to cover-up and censor the evidence on 9/11 TV Fakery and use of ExoW on 9/11 and infiltration of the 9/11 "truth movement" at the TOP as in David Ray Griffin, a multiple cultist, Rockefeller- and One World Government Supporter, plus StarWars/ExoW developers and/or supporter/contractors: Steven E Jones, Bob Bowman, Jim Hoffman, as expressed in older articles at 911closeup.com, which got hacked last night, obviously by supporters of U.S. Government Front 911blogger.com

Peters furthermore continues to coverup the suspicious actions of GeorgeWashington aka Dane Alexander Floum, formerly associated with clients of Los Alamos and U.S. Department of Energy.

The activities of Floum and PJones can be considered as criminal and unconstitutional.

t.b.c...

 
At 20 January, 2007 19:37, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Daniel Hopsicker Hanging Out With David Irving...Turns out that Hopsicker was a featured speaker at a "Real History, USA" conference hosted by Holocaust Revisionist Supreme, David Irving.


What a great way to start the topic, I see that you're trying to discredit Hopsicker for being present at a conference hosted by a holocaust revisionist, just because you hang out with a man who has different view points on the holocaust subject doesn't mean you share the same views. I suggest you to go read his at his website, in no way is this man an anti-semite.


It relies heavily on Amanda Keller, who has admitted that she was not Atta's girlfriend. And the FBI agrees


Oh yeah, sure, even though she clearly stated that it was Mohamed Atta as the man she knew in a recorded interview, mentioned some of the arab hijackers he was hanging out with (along with other people who lived in Venice who Hopsicker also made short interviews with on camera), mentioned the same exact locations Atta was in while in Florida(that the 9/11 commission also mentions), talked about FBI intimidation, Wolfgang Bohringer (A German citizen who the FBI put out a terror alert for, something which proves that Hopsicker's interview with Amanda was as real as it gets). Just becuase the Herlad Tribune said that it was not the same Atta and quoted some unknown FBI agent "confirming" that, then I guess it was a different Mohamed Atta that Keller was talking about in her 3 hour 2002 interview with Hopsicker. The funny thing is that the Sarasota Herald Tribune, Charlotte Sun, and Venice Gondolier (all local newspapers in the Florida areas in which Atta was in) which first reported eyewitness accounts of Atta at the Sandpiper.


Of course, to conspiracy theorists, that's just evidence that the FBI is in on the plot.


No, it just means that they are covering up evidence (something in which the FBI usually does) under orders from the Pentagon.

Moving on...


And I suspect that this is the book's central trick. Hopsicker assumes Atta is Arajaki, and therefore, when his witnesses call him Mohamed he dutifully quotes them, but then adds some side commentary about how "Atta sure doesn't sound like a devout Muslim to me!"...."The two girls were introduced to two men from Germany that they said were Mohamed's friends," Tony LaConca continued. "I thought it was strange, because Mohamed didn't appear to be French-Canadian or German....Atta was meeting "two men from Germany" in Key West, who we will later learn flew in solely to meet him. This is the first hint we have gotten that all of Mohamed Atta's associates don't face East five times every day.


Hopsicker explains all of that that in this article (including german conections which early news reports in the media also confirmed). And just for further proof which prove that man was indeed Mohamed Atta, check out Hopsicker's video interviews of the eyewitnesses (including people who were working at Huffman aviation).



Fredrickson refers to him as Atta several times. But what about the point up above about how Amanda "knew him as Mohamed Arajaki"? See the problem?


See what I posted above. And Fredricksons account is further proof of the early news reports and the video interviews.


In fact, says Grapentine, the FBI was positively frosty, especially on the subject of talking to reporters...."They called me a liar, and told me to keep my mouth shut," states the ex-marine grimly. "Nobody likes to hear that; that they didn't see something they know they saw."


Oh boy, you're acting just like the CT'ists right now, ignoring what you don't like to hear, do you realize that Pat? Click here for all of Hopsicker's articles on Charles Grapentine. He's also in the video archive, along with other Venice citizens who were ignored and intimidated by the FBI.

Stick the check in the freezer? Wouldn't it be simpler and involve less interaction with Mohammed to say "Stick the check in the mail?" Would a terrorist agree to an arrangement where his landlady could come into his apartment pick up the check? It doesn't pass the reasonability test. It's a nonsense story, unless of course the boyfriend was not a terrorist. Even then it sounds dubious. Do landladies often rent to people who are curt and rude with them?


This is the funniest and most pointless part of your topic, great job at refuting the book.


BTW, just in case you're wondering of why I believe Daniel Hopsicker's story on the 9/11 hijackers connection to the drug trade, let's just say that there is a person by the name of Sibel Edmonds (the most gagged person in US history) who was brave enough to come out expose the drug connection when she said "The 9/11 terror plot intersected with the activities of a drug trafficking network of international scope, in ways that form a 'crystal clear' picture of what was going on". John Ashcroft went to the Supreme Court to silence and keep her from revealing what she had learned in translated documents and wiretap recordings.

Read more about here: http://sibeledmonds.blogspot.com/

 
At 20 January, 2007 19:48, Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.911bloglines.com
http://www.bloglines.com/blog/ewing2001?id=2627
Sat, Jan 20 2007

9/11 TruthlingGate: Hillary Win could mean delay of 9/11 'truth' until 2016?

By ewing2001

Orwellian 9/11 TruthlingGate:

Hillary Win could mean delay of 9/11 'truth' until 2016...



Thanks to Orwellan CyberFascists like multiple Cultist David Ray "One World Government" Griffin, Steven "Los Alamos" Jones, Bob "StarWars" Bowman, U.S. Government Front 911blogger.com, Alex "Scientology" Jones + Co., who are covering up the truth on 9/11 TV Fakery, the use of ExoW on 9/11 and the Infiltration at the TOP of this movement, a win of Hillary Clinton could mean 8 years more delay of any "9/11 Truth" plus WW4/5 between U.S., Russia and China...

Did the real 9/11 perps win once and forever?

picked up at:
Shocker: Hillary Clinton Will Run for President
National Ledger, AZ -

 
At 20 January, 2007 20:04, Blogger Simon Lazarus said...

I have evidence that David Irving worked at one of the death camps - either Treblinka or Bergen Belsen.

My proof? The fact that he denies that the Holocaust happened is proof enough.

The fact that he is allegedly too young to have served in WWII only means that he got to the officials who make out birth certificates and bribed them to forge them.

Yeah - that's the ticket.

 
At 20 January, 2007 20:06, Blogger Simon Lazarus said...

just say that there is a person by the name of Sibel Edmonds (the most gagged person in US history)

Oh, yeah - Sibel Edmonds.

Notice that even the Bush-hating media, like Keith Dimbulbermann at MSNBC and those at CNN won't even bother to bring her up, because her story is as hilarious as the rest of the Troother nutcases.

 
At 20 January, 2007 20:28, Blogger Alex said...

a person by the name of Sibel Edmonds (the most gagged person in US history)

Wow. That must have been one hell of a load....

 
At 20 January, 2007 21:32, Blogger Pat said...

BG, loved that MP3! I had heard the Jones retort, hadn't bothered listening to Stadtmiller. I wonder if he really has the goods on Jones using drugs?

 
At 20 January, 2007 21:39, Blogger Pat said...

When Edmonds was on 60 Minutes, her interview focused on charges having little to do with 9-11, which is not surprising since Edmonds was not with the FBI prior to 9-11. She initially reported that her bosses encouraged her to drag her feet on translating documents so they could get more staff. IIRC there was also something about a superior who was having an affair with a Turkish diplomat. She really appears to have nothing to tell us about 9-11 except in the fevered fantasies of the Deniers

 
At 20 January, 2007 22:35, Blogger Triterope said...

I see that BG, Ewing, and "Critical Thinker" have posted, but none has bothered to answer my original question: why does any of this matter?

 
At 21 January, 2007 01:21, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Triterope, I think what the Amanda Keller story supposedly proved was that Atta was not really an Islamic fundamentalist, because he was whoring around in Florida. And there was something about 9/11 being a coverup for drug smuggling in Florida or something like that. Jack Abramahof was in their somehow, also. Even if true, I never saw the connection. I think Hopsicker's agenda is to divert and discredit, and him associating with David Irving fits in with that.

 
At 21 January, 2007 01:25, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Pat, we agree that Sibel Edmonds has nothing to tell us about 9/11. I'm a little curious why you think that, though, because her story fits right in with the government's incompetence theory.

 
At 21 January, 2007 05:43, Blogger The Artistic Macrophage said...

maybe because it is not about making evidence fit a story, but rather the validity of the evidence, regardless of which story it supports...jhc this isnt a game about making the story fit.

TAM

 
At 21 January, 2007 07:15, Blogger Pat said...

Ningen, we don't subscribe to the incompetence theory, and neither does the government. There were some screwups, but for the most part 9-11 represented a failure to imagine something that had never happened before.

 
At 21 January, 2007 11:07, Blogger The Artistic Macrophage said...

A failure to imagine, and a failure to communicate.

TAM

 
At 21 January, 2007 16:58, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Triterope said...

I see that BG, Ewing, and "Critical Thinker" have posted, but none has bothered to answer my original question: why does any of this matter?


I didn't mean to be ignoring you, Triterope.

Short answer, I don't know for sure if it does.

 
At 22 January, 2007 10:18, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Critical_Thinker-Nice job on proving the point. There is overwhelming evdience that Atta and Keller were an item. This blog has hit this issue in the past and I pointed out the same issues as before. But they will accept an unnamed source's word as the final truth.

Yeah lets gag Sibel because well because a co-worker is sleeping with someone. Yeah that makes no sense compared to the connections of what she discovered between drugs and 9/11.

TriteThe point is an independent journalist is following the leads, contacts, associates, and money trail of the 'lead hijacker'. Something the FBI has apparently turned a blind eye to for some reason.

but for the most part 9-11 represented a failure to imagine something that had never happened before.

Great! No one takes responibility, all have plausible deniability, and the only way to fix the issue is a better imagination? Why the military budget increases, attacks on the bill of rights, etc. etc. when all we have to do is have a better imagination.

Nevermind all of the warnings given to government officials, the revealing of Project Bojinka in '95, the list goes on.

I hope your Professor doesn't hold that comment against you.

Love it..failure to imagine!

 
At 22 January, 2007 15:49, Blogger shawn said...

attacks on the bill of rights

Which right of the ten have you lost? I've lost zero.

Nevermind all of the warnings given to government officials, the revealing of Project Bojinka in '95, the list goes on.

Well, professor, Bojinka was hijacking planes and blowing them up over an ocean - killing only the planes occupants. Tell me how that translates to "hijack plane, use as missle and fly into big landmarks".

 
At 23 January, 2007 05:48, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Shawn Of course you haven't! You don't know what you've lost, until it is gone.
http://www.actionamerica.org/
constitution/y2kbor.shtml

Good point on Bojinka. I guess blowing up a plane in the ocean is a tad different than blowing up a plane by hitting a tower. One is a flying bomb and the other is a bomb flying.

Will you be addressing the numerous other warnings as well, Shawn?

What exactly were all those drills going on in Washington and around the country anyway?

Or do you accept the USG had numerous prior warnings about an event such as this taking place within our borders?

Or do you subscribe to Pat's failure to imagine theory?

 
At 23 January, 2007 05:57, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

More on Sibel Edmonds:
I want to close this part of my talk on the allegations of Sibel Edmonds. Unfortunately we don’t really know what they are because she is under a gag order. That for reasons of state she is not able to tell the public what she told the FBI. She was a whistleblower, who naively did what a whistleblower should do in the name of protecting the American public order, and got fired for it. And she is still fighting to appeal her case. She can’t talk, but she has talked here and there. And my friend Daniel Ellsberg is very interested in her case; and very recently he summed up what she is saying for KPFA, my local Pacifica radio station. This is Ellsberg’s summary of what Sibel Edmonds is saying:

Al Qaeda, she’s been saying to Congress, is financed 95% by drug money, drug traffic to which the U.S. government shows a blind eye, has been ignoring because it very heavily involves allies and assets of ours, such as Turkey, Kyrayzstan, Tajikistan, Pakistan, Afghanistan - all of the Stans, in a drug traffic where the opium originates in Afghanistan, is processed in Turkey and delivered to Europe where it furnishes 96% of Europe’s heroin by Albanians, either in Albania or Kosovo, Albanian muslims in Kosovo, basically the KLA Kosovo Liberation Army (which we backed heavily in that episode at the end of the century, that’s last century) ---–

[I will interrupt at this point. In my book, I’m sure I think I quite adequately document that:

A) That the KLA was deeply involved or its leaders were deeply involved in drug trafficking and have used the NATO intervention as a way to consolidate a drug route through Kosovo and

B) that they were very heavily involved with al Qaeda. Al-Zawahiri’s brother came to organize KLA things and al-Zawahiri himself may have come to Kosovo.

C) At the same time key KLA leaders were allied with PMCs – Private Military Corporations -- notably DynCorp. Those of you who were here last night heard Cynthia McKinney ask about DynCorp – and why the defense department worked with them. There are war crimes attributed to KLA leaders who in Croatia worked hand in glove with DynCorp.

I’m cutting out a lot here that is relevant. But Sibel Edmonds says "Suitcases of cash were delivered to the Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert at his home near Chicago from Turkish sources, knowing that a lot of that is drug money." 38

These are very serious charges that were aired to some extent in some in Vanity Fair.39 And they are so important that the media, predictably, ignored them. And I’m drawing attention to what she is saying not because what she is saying can be proven, but these charges are very serious and not just pertinent to 9/11 alone, but to the whole fabric of how this country is run.

I consider this a top priority for testing the honesty and credibility of the new Democratic leadership in Congress. Will they pursue these matters? I hope that by hook or by crook you will try and put pressure on the new Democratic Congress to deal with these matters, so that we get a proper investigation of them for the first time.

And to close this section, whatever is the extent of what she is describing, it’s not just her. There was another witness, Indira Singh, who was talking at a 9/11 conference up in Canada; and she said, "I was told that if I mentioned the money to the drugs around 9/11 that would be the end of me." 40

This is a woman who has nothing to do with Sibel Edmonds, but alluded to the same thing in the background of 9/11.41 And we need to learn more about that. And I suspect that whatever the situation is, it’s something which goes back to at least as far as 1963, and would then explain the same background for the Kennedy assassination.

One thing we can say with confidence: the flow of Afghan heroin west through Turkey is a problem that can be traced back to the CIA’s involvement with Pakistan’s ISI intelligence service, with the drug-linked Bank of Credit and Commerce International (BCCI), and with Islamist Afghan mujahedeen like Gulbuddin Hekmatyar in the 1980s.42

In fact the web of influence she describes corresponds closely to BCCI’s influence in the 1980s, when the head of BCCI used to boast to the head of Pakistan of BCCI’s role in getting aid for Pakistan approved by the US Congress.43

let me first note that footnote 38 where he is quoting Ellsberg re Sibel actually refers to this blog. yay. i'm famous for transcribing an old interview (yay, me). let me also note that i know NOTHING about indira singh - i should chase that up.

I'll also note that I, too, followed up on that comment by Ellsberg by writing a post on the KLA. My introduction to that post:

In this post, we see that:

1. The US turned a blind eye to the Kosovo Liberation Army's heroin dealing, which financed al-Qaeda
2. Perle & Feith financed the KLA, and there was 'spillage' to al-Qaeda
3. Hastert was bribed with this heroin money
4. The KLA sent weapons to the 'islamofascists' in Chechnya
5. Perle & Feith sent weapons to the 'islamofascists' in Chechnya

Abramoff, Viktor Bout, Bob Ney, and Sibel also get honorary mentions.

Source:
http://wotisitgood4.blogspot.com/2006/12/
peter-dale-scott-sibel-edmonds.html

 
At 23 January, 2007 07:40, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have evidence that David Irving worked at one of the death camps - either Treblinka or Bergen Belsen.

My proof? The fact that he denies that the Holocaust happened is proof enough.

The fact that he is allegedly too young to have served in WWII only means that he got to the officials who make out birth certificates and bribed them to forge them.



HAHAHA, so you're comparing David Irving to Sibel Edmonds, an anti-semite who thinks that there was a cover up to a lady who knows that there was a cover up, you're comparing an idiot who never saw any evidence of a cover up to a lady who saw and heard real evidence of a cover up (Most gagged person in US history, how many times do I gotta remind you?).



A failure to imagine, and a failure to communicate.


I love it when people say that. Warnings of future attacks on the WTC and planes being used as missiles prove that the "failure to imagine" claim is a lie. Also, read these stories on Robert Wright, Randy Glass, and http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rls=RNWE,RNWE:2006-16,RNWE:en&pwst=1&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=Indira+singh&spell=1, Able Danger, and you will clearly see that it was not a "failure to communicate", instead it was high ranking officials in the Pentagon who stopped the investigations.




Swing Dangler, thanks, you posted some pretty good info there, people are bashing me about mentioning Sibel Edmonds and they didn't even bother to read this link that I gave them. Swing Dangler, what's your email?

 
At 23 January, 2007 07:44, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Correction: Also, read these stories on Robert Wright, Randy Glass, Indira singh, Able Danger...

 
At 23 January, 2007 10:53, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Shawn I retract my good point statement of Bojinkia and insert you don't read enough

Using Planes as Bombs

The Pentagon commissioned an expert panel in 1993 to investigate the possibility of an airplane being used to bomb national landmarks. Retired Air Force Col. Doug Menarchik, who organised the $150,000 study for the Defense Department’s Office of Special Operations and Low-Intensity Conflict, recalled: “It was considered radical thinking, a little too scary for the times. After I left, it met a quiet death.” Other participants have noted that the decision not to publish detailed scenarios issued to some extent from fear that this may give terrorists ideas. Nevertheless, a draft document detailing the results of the investigation was circulated through the Pentagon, the Justice Department and the Federal Emergency Management Agency. Senior agency officials decided against a public release.[2]

The veracity of the Pentagon’s “radical thinking” was confirmed in 1994 when there occurred three attempted attacks on buildings using airplanes. The first, in April of that year, involved a Federal Express flight engineer facing dismissal.

Having boarded a DC-10 as a passenger, he invaded the cockpit, planning to crash the plane into a company building in Memphis. Fortunately, he was overpowered by the crew.

The second attempt occurred in September. A lone pilot crashed a small plane into a tree on the White House grounds, just short of the President’s bedroom.

The third incident occurred in December. An Air France flight in Algiers was hijacked by members of the Armed Islamic Group (GIA)— who are linked to Al-Qaeda—aiming to crash it into the Eiffel Tower. French Special Forces stormed the plane on the ground.[3]

Al-Qaeda’s Plans: Project Bojinka

Western intelligence had been aware of plans for such terrorist attacks on U.S. soil as early as 1995. Both the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) had detailed information about the possible use of hijack/suicide attacks by terrorists connected to Osama bin Laden. The New York Times reported that:

“In 1994, two jetliners were hijacked by people who wanted to crash them into buildings, one of them by an Islamic militant group. And the 2000 edition of the FAA’s annual report on Criminal Acts Against Aviation, published this year, said that although Osama bin Laden ‘is not known to have attacked civil aviation, he has both the motivation and the wherewithal to do so,’ adding, ‘Bin Laden’s anti-Western and anti-American attitudes make him and his followers a significant threat to civil aviation, particularly to U.S. civil aviation.’”[4]

Moreover, the U.S. intelligence community was aware of bin Laden’s specific intentions to use hijacked civilian planes as weapons. In this regard, the Chicago Sun-Times reported that:

“The FBI had advance indications of plans to hijack U.S. airliners and use them as weapons, but neither acted on them nor distributed the intelligence to local police agencies. From the moment of the September 11th attacks, high-ranking federal officials insisted that the terrorists’ method of operation surprised them. Many stick to that story. Actually, elements of the hijacking plan were known to the FBI as early as 1995 and, if coupled with current information, might have uncovered the plot.”[5]

Details of these advanced indications have been noted in a report by the respected German daily, Die Welt: “Western secret services knew as far back as 1995 that suspected terror mastermind Osama bin Laden planned to attack civilian sites using commercial passenger planes.” Quoting sources “close to western intelligence agencies,” the newspaper reported that: “The plan was discovered in January 1995 by Philippine police who were investigating a possible attack against Pope John Paul II on a visit to Manila…

“They found details of the plan in a computer seized in an apartment used by three men who were part of Bin Laden’s al‑Qaeda network. It provided for 11 planes to be exploded simultaneously by bombs placed on board, but also in an alternative form for several planes flying to the United States to be hijacked and flown into civilian targets. Among targets mentioned was the World Trade Center in New York, which was destroyed in the September 11 terror attacks in the United States that killed thousands.”

This plot “re-surfaced during the trial in New York in 1997 of Pakistani Ramsi Yousef, the mastermind of the attack on the World Trade Center in 1993... [The] U.S. Federal Bureau of Investigation and CIA would have known about the plan at the latest at this time.”[6] As the Washington DC-based Public Education Center (PEC) observes, “Federal investigative sources have confirmed that Murad”—who was “a close confidant and right-hand man to Yousef, who was convicted of crimes relating to the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center”—“detailed an entire plot to dive bomb aircraft in the headquarters of the Central Intelligence Agency in Langley, VA.” along with other U.S. buildings. “Yousef independently boasted of the plot to U.S. Secret Service agent Brian Parr and FBI agent Charles Stern on an extradition flight from Pakistan to the United States in February 1995,” continues the PEC report. “The agents later testified to that fact in court… [T]he plan targeted not only the CIA but other U.S. government buildings in Washington, including the Pentagon.”[7]

Rafael M. Garcia III, Chairman/CEO of the Mega Group of Computer Companies in the Philippines, who often works with the National Bureau of Investigation (NBI) in his field of expertise, was involved in the intelligence operation that uncovered Project Bojinka. Garcia was responsible for the decoding of Yousef’s computer. “This was how we found out about the various plots being hatched by the cell of Ramzi Yousef. First, there was the plot to assassinate Pope John Paul II,” he observes. “Then, we discovered a second, even more sinister plot: Project Bojinka, or a Yugoslav term for loud bang.[8] This was a plot to blow up 11 airlines over the Pacific Ocean, all in a 48-hour period. The planes would have come from Seoul, Hong Kong, Taipei, Tokyo, Bangkok, Singapore, and Manila…

“Then we found another document that discussed a second alternative to crash the 11 planes into selected targets in the United States instead of just blowing them up in the air. These included the CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia; the World Trade Center in New York; the Sears Tower in Chicago; the TransAmerica Tower in San Francisco; and the White House in Washington, DC… I submitted my findings to NBI officials, who most certainly turned over the report (and the computer) either to then Senior Superintendent Avelino Razon of the PNP [the Philippine National Police] or to Bob Heafner of the FBI… I have since had meetings with certain U.S. authorities and they have confirmed to me that indeed, many things were done in response to my report.”[9]

The World Tribune similarly reports, citing an intelligence source involved in the Philippine operation, that: “The hijacked aircraft were to be crashed into structures in the United States, including the World Trade Center, the White House, Pentagon, the Transamerica tower in San Francisco and the Sears Tower in Chicago.”[10] Paul Monk, Senior Fellow at the Australian Thinking Skills Institute and a Professor at the Australian Defense University, cites “confidential sources” in Manila and Washington detailing that: “Project Bojinka was an AQ [Al-Qaeda] plan to hijack eleven airliners simultaneously, exploding many of them at various places over the Pacific, but flying at least two of them into major federal government buildings in the United States. The flights to be hijacked were specified. They were all United Airlines, Northwest Airlines and Delta flights…

“The plan has been masterminded by one Ramzi Yousef, who was arrested in Islamabad in the wake of Murad’s interrogation. Both Murad and Yousef were extradited to the United States, tried and convicted for complicity in the 1993 attack on the WTC. The date of Yousef’s conviction was 11 September 1996. From that point, given the fascination terrorists have with anniversaries, 11 September should surely have become a watch date.”[11]

Detailed elaboration on this matter is provided by the Washington DC-based media watch group, Accuracy In Media (AIM). AIM has harshly criticised the media for largely ignoring the U.S. intelligence community’s advanced knowledge of Project Bojinka:

“In 1995, the CIA and the FBI learned that Osama bin Laden was planning to hijack U.S. airliners and use them as bombs to attack important targets in the U.S. This scheme was called Project Bojinka. It was discovered in the Philippines, where authorities arrested two of bin Laden’s agents, Ramzi Yousef and Abdul Hakim Murad. They were involved in planting a bomb on a Philippine airliner. Project Bojinka, which Philippine authorities found outlined on Abdul Murad’s laptop, called for planting bombs on eleven U.S. airliners and hijacking others and crashing them into targets like the CIA building…

It required aviators like Japan’s kamikaze pilots who were willing to commit suicide. Bin Laden had no such pilots in 1995, but he set out to train young fanatics willing to die for him to fly airliners. Abdul Murad, whose laptop had revealed the plan, admitted that he was being trained for a suicide mission. Bin Laden began training pilots in Afghanistan with the help of an Afghan pilot and a Pakistani general.

Project Bojinka was known to the CIA and the FBI. It was described in court documents in the trial in New York of Ramzi Yousef and Abdul Murad for their participation in the bombing of the World Trade Center in 1993. Since the CIA had been mentioned as one of the targets in Project Bojinka, it should have had an especially strong interest in any evidence that bin Laden was preparing to carry it out. The most obvious indicator, and one that should have been watched most carefully, was the recruitment of young, dedicated followers to learn to fly American airliners. That would require keeping a close watch on flight schools where that training is given.”
http://www.mediamonitors.net/
mosaddeq36.html

Catch up Shawn, or stop lying and denying

 
At 23 January, 2007 11:04, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Critical_Thinker

You can email me at

swingdangler@hotmail.com

Thanks for the comment. Be careful as most of their statements are trying to bait you into useless discussion as linking Sibel to Irving. They like to do that because they can't counter any of the information you post.
Most of the deniers on this blog don't read or watch lickity split when it comes to counter arguments, which I have destroyed over and over again. Don't be suprised if they don't read what you post. Cheerleaders for the OS is about all you get here.

Second, I contacted Hopsickler about his book being posted online to Pat's links. Daniel to say the least is not happy..
"Im going to have to revisit this. i wrote him--hes a fucking attorney for christ sake-- and his isp a letter; no response.
daniel"

 
At 23 January, 2007 11:51, Blogger Triterope said...

More on Sibel Edmonds:

Good Lord. Where to begin...

For reasons of state she is not able to tell the public what she told the FBI.

And yet, somehow, the conspiracy freaks know all about it.

Al Qaeda, she’s been saying to Congress, is financed 95% by drug money

Which, of course, all new hires in the translation department are in a position to know.

Drug traffic to which the U.S. government shows a blind eye, has been ignoring because it very heavily involves allies and assets of ours, such as Turkey, Kyrayzstan, Tajikistan, Pakistan, Afghanistan

So you're saying the U.S. would rather let Al Qaeda grow than piss off Tajikistan? A nation whose only value to the U.S. is in fighting Al Qaeda? How pathologically stupid.

I'm cutting out a lot here that is relevant.

Don't worry. You're not.

But Sibel Edmonds says "Suitcases of cash were delivered to the Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert at his home near Chicago from Turkish sources, knowing that a lot of that is drug money." 38

Wow, that Sibel Edmonds is a regular Indiana Jones. She can't take a step without tripping over some massive piece of evidence. But I think she's just full of shit.

And let's investigate that footnote 38, shall we?

let me first note that footnote 38 where he is quoting Ellsberg re Sibel actually refers to this blog. yay. i'm famous for transcribing an old interview (yay, me).

Hey, if you can't believe a conspiracy blogger citing himself, who can you believe?

And (these charges) are so important that the media, predictably, ignored them.

The tired old "they're censoring us" card. Real journalists have enough sense to realize that these allegations have no credibility whatsoever.

These are very serious charges that were aired to some extent in some in Vanity Fair.

But you just said the media ignored them. Make up your mind.

I consider this a top priority for testing the honesty and credibility of the new Democratic leadership in Congress.

So do I. I will lose all respect for the new Congress if they waste any time on this obvious garbage.

Indira Singh said, "I was told that if I mentioned the money to the drugs around 9/11 that would be the end of me."

"If I mentioned the money to the drugs"? Can anyone translate that into English?

One thing we can say with confidence: the flow of Afghan heroin west through Turkey is a problem that can be traced back to the CIA’s involvement with Pakistan’s ISI intelligence service, with the drug-linked Bank of Credit and Commerce International (BCCI), and with Islamist Afghan mujahedeen like Gulbuddin Hekmatyar in the 1980s.

Or maybe Europeans just want to get high, and the Middle East is a favorable place to grow the stuff. Once again Smacco's Razor is at work: come up with the most convoluted explanation possible, so long as it proves the desired point.

Abramoff, Viktor Bout, Bob Ney, and Sibel also get honorary mentions.

This is something I've noticed in conspiracy arguments of late: they seem less interested in making a point than they do in dropping as many names as possible.

It's like reading a Liz Smith column: "blah blah Jack Abramoff blah blah Sibel Edmonds blah blah Pakistan blah blah al-Zawahiri blah blah Kosovo blah blah blah Dennis Hastert blah blah Cynthia McKinney."

Which, frankly, is all this conspiracy junk sounds like to me anymore. I can't even discern a point in all this stuff.

 
At 25 January, 2007 12:10, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

So you're saying the U.S. would rather let Al Qaeda grow than piss off Tajikistan? A nation whose only value to the U.S. is in fighting Al Qaeda? How pathologically stupid.

Well you left out Pakistan in your analysis. Tajikistan also happens to be located in a pretty strategic area mind you.

All in all, Trite, wouldn't you say Sibel is about 1000% more credible in her observations made during her time as being employed by the U.S. government than a little blogger like yourself?
I thought so.

The drug trade and its links to intel agencies is a documented fact. However your last statment doesn't really counter anything.

 
At 25 January, 2007 15:02, Blogger Triterope said...

Well you left out Pakistan in your analysis. Tajikistan also happens to be located in a pretty strategic area mind you.

As usual, SD misses the point entirely.

wouldn't you say Sibel is about 1000% more credible in her observations made during her time as being employed by the U.S. government than a little blogger like yourself?

Sure, in the sense that zero times 1000 is still zero.

I could go on, but it's easier just to call you stupid. Good day to you, sir.

 
At 26 January, 2007 06:59, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Trite Sure it is easier as it is to admit that she is dead on.

LOL! And besides you really didn't discredit her statements at all mind you. Just the usual OS responses.

And...good day to you!

 

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