Saturday, May 27, 2006

Loose Change Telephone Game

When I was in grade school we used to play the telephone game, where one kid whispers a sentence into the ear of the person sitting in the seat next to them. By the time it gets clear around the classroom it has mutated into something completely different, and usually pretty amusing. Well this is how conspiracy theories work.

In the movie Dylan and company claim:

But on Thursday the 6th, bomb sniffing dogs were abruptly removed from the building.So who authorized all this?

President Bush's brother, Marvin, was Board of Directors at Securacom from 1993 until fiscal year 2000.


This takes two completely separate, although technically correct pieces of information, and runs them together to form a false impression.

First of all, not all bomb sniffing dogs were removed from the buildings, just the ones that were part of the extra security. The Loose Change folks manage to turn a heightened security period into some type of security lapse. Kind of like how politicians complain that if you were planning to increase the spending of a program 8%, but you only increase it 5%, then you are cutting spending.

Secondly, as the movie says, Bush left Securacom (actually Stratasec) in 2000 He was gone over 14 months by the time the attacks came around. And as a member of the board of directors, he would have had nothing to do with the day to day operations anyway, much less the security dogs. Stratesec did not run security for the WTC, they were just responsible for electronic security systems. The dogs were part of the port police, and possibly other companies working on contract. By putting these two completely unrelated facts together though, the filmmakers are able to give the viewer a completely false impression, although they technically never "lie".

But the telephone game doesn't stop here. In their extra video footage, one of the trio, who apparently never even saw his own movie promotes Marvin Bush to "head of security at the World Trade Center".

So now that this already been changed, even before getting out of the original group, I was not at all surprised to see this posted in a list of 9/11 "facts" in response to an editorial yesterday.

27 Marvin Bush involvement with the security security for the World Trade Center, United Airlines, and Dulles International Airport. He gave the order to have the bomb sniffing dogs removed before 9/11. security contracts for the WTC complex ended 9-11-01

You start out with one thing, play fast and loose with the connections, and before you know it, you have a whole new list of "facts".

Update:

One could have all sorts of fun with this rhetorical device. For example, from my upcoming feature film "The Secret Lives of the Loose Change Guys"

In 2003 prisoners were sexually humiliated in the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq. They were stripped naked, dog collars were put on their necks, womens' underwear was put on their heads. Who ordered this to be done?

In 2003, Loose Change producer Korey Rowe was serving in Iraq.

19 Comments:

At 27 May, 2006 20:24, Blogger MarkyX said...

Paul O'Neill is the one who did the authorization, not Marvin I believe.

He died in the attacks. Odd how he worked in the FBI went would get himself killed over a conspriacy he knew..

Um, right?

 
At 27 May, 2006 20:33, Blogger James B. said...

I think you mean John O'Neill. Paul O'Neill played right field for those hated Yankees. ;-)

 
At 27 May, 2006 21:12, Blogger Pat said...

Paulie! Paulie!

:)

Pat, whose Arizona Diamondbacks won our first real pro championship against the Yankees in the bottom of the ninth, game seven.

 
At 27 May, 2006 21:13, Blogger nesNYC said...

The White House was asked of the scope of the involvement with Marvin at Startasec/Securacom and they never replied. All they had to do was reply to clear the air, why didn't they?

Even though, Bush's involvement isn't as benign as you're making out to be. An operation of the scope of 9/11 would take quite a while to get into place and exactly the timeframe M. Bush was in someway involved.

More details here.

 
At 27 May, 2006 21:20, Blogger nesNYC said...

John O'Neil's first day at work as chief of security for the WTC was 9/11/2001.

More on O'Neil:

THE MAN WHO KNEW
FBI agent John O'Neil tracked Osama Bin Laden obsessively for six years, much to the annoyance of his superiors in Washington who thought that he had gone overboard. O'Neil came close to uncovering Al Qaeda's intentions after the bombing of the U.S.S. Cole in Yemen, but his investigation was blocked by the U.S. ambassador there. O'Neil was in frequent conflict with FBI director Louis Freeh. After finally resigning from the FBI in despair, O'Neil signed on as chief of security for the World Trade Center. He died on 9/11. PBS Frontline is rebroadcasting O'Neil's story. The complete broadcast is viewable on line along with comprehensive background notes and interviews. (PBS Frontline, April 2004)


Source

 
At 27 May, 2006 21:39, Blogger undense said...

The White House was asked of the scope of the involvement with Marvin at Startasec/Securacom and they never replied. All they had to do was reply to clear the air, why didn't they?

Marvin Bush's involvement in Startasec/Securacom is no business of the White House. Nor does the White House have any official capacity to define what that involvement was.

So your supposition that by somehow not responding the White House is hiding something or had to "clear the air" is yet another in one of your long line of red herrings.

Besides that, we all know you don't give any credence to what the White House says anyway. So what's the point in even bringing that up in the first place?

 
At 27 May, 2006 22:03, Blogger nesNYC said...

Marvin Bush's involvement in Startasec/Securacom is no business of the White House.

Same way Jeb had nothing to do with Dubya being in Florida on 9/11. Mmmmmkaayy...

 
At 27 May, 2006 22:07, Blogger shawn said...

So, nesnyc, Marvin was gone fourteen months before the attacks, FIVE MONTHS longer than Dubya was in office? So Clinton is in on it, too?

 
At 27 May, 2006 22:08, Blogger nesNYC said...

So your supposition that by somehow not responding the White House is hiding something or had to "clear the air" is yet another in one of your long line of red herrings.

What if Hillary would have stayed silent of the Bill issue? She did the opposite and stood by her man right?

But all the Bush administration had to do was say "The president's brother's involvement with Securacom was simply administrative" or something to that effect. But they just flat out stayed silent. Isn't it a wonder that all these allegations got blown out of proportion or are they trying to hide something? Come on, it doesn't take a genius to figure out the Bush family is kneed deep in 9/11 "anomalies."

 
At 27 May, 2006 22:16, Blogger nesNYC said...

So, nesnyc, Marvin was gone fourteen months before the attacks, FIVE MONTHS longer than Dubya was in office? So Clinton is in on it, too?

How did you jump to that conclusion? The "Powers that be" knew Dubya was going to be selected way ahead of time and laid the ground work for 9/11 early on. The fact that Clinton was dogged by Neoconserative hit man Kenneth Starr laid the ground work that there would be a Republican administration when Clinton was no more. That and the fact the election was rigged anyway added more credibility to the rigging.

But anyway, at least for me, I find it pretty suspect that the President's brother was "elected" to the boards of the very companies that would somehow be tied to 9/11 a little bit down the line.

Of course these obvious facts are meaningless to "coincidence" theorists because, hey, it was just a coincidence, right? LOL.

 
At 27 May, 2006 22:25, Blogger shawn said...

"Powers that be" knew Dubya was going to be selected way ahead of time and laid the ground work for 9/11 early on.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 
At 27 May, 2006 22:26, Blogger shawn said...

I wish I was ignorant enough to know circular logic isn't a viable defense, I'd be in the same boat as nesnyc and think my ideas were bulletproof.

Well, I'm off to bed gents, see y'all tomorrow.

 
At 28 May, 2006 06:27, Blogger undense said...

Same way Jeb had nothing to do with Dubya being in Florida on 9/11. Mmmmmkaayy...

Do you know what a non sequitur is?

What if Hillary would have stayed silent of the Bill issue? She did the opposite and stood by her man right?

But all the Bush administration had to do was say "The president's brother's involvement with Securacom was simply administrative" or something to that effect. But they just flat out stayed silent. Isn't it a wonder that all these allegations got blown out of proportion or are they trying to hide something? Come on, it doesn't take a genius to figure out the Bush family is kneed deep in 9/11 "anomalies."


no, it doesn't take a genius. Far from it. You're living proof of that.

 
At 28 May, 2006 06:31, Blogger shawn said...

Do you know what a non sequitur is?

I don't think any of these guys had heard of a logical fallacy before they came posting on here, let alone know all of them.

 
At 28 May, 2006 07:20, Blogger MarkyX said...

Yep, John

Found one error in the viewer's guide, blah.

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/09/12/victim.wtc.security/

He started working a month before, not "on" 9/11.

 
At 28 May, 2006 10:02, Blogger nesNYC said...

Do you know what a non sequitur is?

Sure, it's how you guys perceive the world and why you can't understand squat...

 
At 28 May, 2006 10:57, Blogger shawn said...

Sure, it's how you guys perceive the world and why you can't understand squat...

You know, you can't pretend logical fallacies don't exist just because you use them and they render your arguments false.

 
At 28 May, 2006 23:12, Blogger KLN said...

I am really anticipating your upcoming movie "The Secret Lives of the Loose Change Guys" It will be interesting to see what you can uncover about tese guys. I know a few of them from living in Oneonta NY and it will be exciting to see what else you are able to find out about them. When do you expect to have it completed?

 
At 30 May, 2006 00:37, Blogger James B. said...

Sorry, that was an attempt at sarcastic humor. Although we will continue to cover this movie, its filmmakers, and 9/11 conspiracies in general, we are not planning to to try our hands at movie making.

 

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