Monday, May 15, 2006

The Top Lies and Deceptions of Loose Change 11-20

11. Claim: The only damage to the outer wall of the Pentagon was a single hole, no more than 16 feet in diameter.

Truth: The hole was approximately 90 feet wide. The 16 foot measurement was only achieved by looking at pictures where the rest of the hole was obscured by smoke and foam from the firefighters. Source

12. Claim: No wreckage was found on the Pentagon lawn.

Truth: There are numerous pictures of plane wreckage, including those with the American Airlines paint scheme. Source

13. Claim: A 16 foot hole was punched in the C ring of the Pentagon by the airplane’s soft carbon fiber nose.

Truth: It was a 12 foot hole, and it was made by the much more resilient nose landing gear. Source

14. Claim: A cruise missile hit the Pentagon

Truth: Over a hundred documented witnesses, and many more unrecorded, saw in broad daylight a large commercial jetliner crash into the Pentagon. Many even specifically identified the airline. To this day, not a single person has come forward claiming to have seen a cruise missile. Source, source.

15. Claim: A white marking on the lawn the week before indicated the path of the crash.

Truth: This section of the Pentagon was being renovated and cables were being laid. And why would a cruise missile need directions anyway? Source

16. Claim: A number of military personnel at the Pentagon specifically mentioned smelling cordite.

Truth: The person (not a number of military personnel) in question was a lawyer not a munitions expert, and cordite is used in ammunition, not explosives. Source

17. Claim: WTC 7, a 47 story office building 300 feet away from the North Tower, suddenly collapsed for no reason.

Truth: There was nothing sudden about it. The building was hit by falling debris from one of the towers, was missing much of one corner, had a huge hole in the middle and was on fire for hours. The building had started leaning and making creaking noises so fire department officials ordered the evacuation of the area over an hour earlier. Source and here

18. Claim: On July 28th, 1945, a B-52 bomber lost in the fog crashed into the 79th floor of the Empire State Building, 14 people dead, 1 million dollars in damage. But, the building stands intact to this day.

Truth: It was a B-25 bomber (the B-52 was not produced until 9 years later), a propeller driven plane about 1/10th the size of a 767, and was traveling about ¼ the speed. The fire only covered part of one floor, and was extinguished in less than an hour. Source

19. Claim: On February 23rd, 1991, a 38 story skyscraper in Philadelphia burned for more than 19 hours and spread over 8 floors. It did not collapse.

Truth: The firefighters fought the fire for 11 hours before they evacuated the building fearing a collapse. The building, which was never hit by an aircraft, was structurally unsound and later had to be demolished. Source

20. Claim: The south tower collapsed in just 9.2 seconds.

Truth: It is difficult to time because of all the smoke and debris, but it took significantly longer. Source

74 Comments:

At 15 May, 2006 19:14, Blogger roger_sq said...

This is all nitpicking minutae. And again I would advise against using the Kean Commission as a reference, unless you wish to investigate the high standards of sourcing used therein with such ambition you'd show to Loose Change. The argument, "Bigfoot doesn't exist because the unicorns told me so" is not a valid premise.

I know you have no interest in the truth (as stated, duly noted), but I have to wonder, as you find yourselves having to discard more and more questions without answers, evidence without gaping holes...as you continue to sweep all of what doesn't make sense under the rug to make it all fun and games... are you ready yet to admit that you have been swayed, that you are far less certain about the events of 9/11 than you were when you set out to harpoon this whopper?

It's ok if you don't want to admit it, your writing is giving it away. But it would be honorable if you fessed up.

good luck...

 
At 15 May, 2006 19:51, Blogger James B. said...

ROTLFMAO Nitpicking minutae? Yeah, claiming the hole in the outside is only 16 feet wide, therefore it must have been a cruise missile, when in reality it was 90 feet wide.

Claiming that no aircraft parts were found at the pentagon when there are numerous pictures and/or personal accounts of fuselage parts, engines, body parts, air craft seats. etc.

Just minor details... insignficant really...

 
At 15 May, 2006 20:29, Blogger ScottSl said...

Standard CTer. Anything you debunk just isn't important. LOL!!! I love the logic. Keep saving these!

 
At 15 May, 2006 23:42, Blogger Alex said...

I'm willing to admit I've been swayed: I'm far less certain about the mental stability of the CT crowd than before you guys set out to harpoon this whopper. I used to think most of them were just misguided, however each time one of their pet theories is debunked and we see them jumping and desperately clinging on to yet another nonsential part of their Grand Unified Conspiracy Theory, it becomes more and more clear that they are truly insane.

 
At 16 May, 2006 00:17, Blogger d said...

u guys are in denial..take a good fucking look around u and see whats really happening....u have no sources.

 
At 16 May, 2006 09:55, Blogger shokk said...

It's sad that some people like roger are so sick that they have to fabricate reality to keep from dealing with what really happened.

 
At 18 May, 2006 14:44, Blogger George Bruce said...

Some of these really crack me up.

"16. Claim: Military personnel at the Pentagon smelled cordite at the crash site indicating the use of explosives.

Truth: The person in question was a lawyer, and cordite is used in ammunition, not explosives."

AND, cordite hasn't been used in ammunition in about 100 years.

"18. Claim: On July 28th, 1945, a B-52 bomber lost in the fog crashed into the 79th floor of the Empire State Building, 14 people dead, 1 million dollars in damage. But, the building stands intact to this day.

Truth: It was a B-25 bomber, a propeller driven plane about 1/10th the size of a 767, and was traveling about ¼ the speed. The fire only covered part of one floor, and was extinguished in less than an hour."

AND, B-52s didn't exist in 1945

This one takes the cake:

15. Claim: A white marking on the lawn the week before indicated the path of the crash.

Truth: This section of the Pentagon was being renovated and cables were being laid. And why would a cruise missile need directions anyway?

Why indeed.

 
At 18 May, 2006 16:52, Blogger sumy23 said...

Come on James. Sources please!! I got about 200 friends I'm trying to prove wrong here. I could write this stuff and even the stuff in the PM article.

CLAIM: Bombs not melted steel beams brought down the world trade centers.

FACT:Steel melts at 3000 degrees but starts to lose structural integrity at around 1500. So we didnt bother talking about how long a fuel fire would have to burn directly on top of a steel beam of x(thickness) in order for it to start to bend.

Of course why would popular mechanics and their pannel of 70 experts that work in the field bother to do a real experiment like that. How long did the towers burn for before that fire fighter said the fire was almost out and all he needed was 2 lines. Oh and fire does not burn uniformly hot. So the popular mechanics gurus would have to throw that into the mix too.

Whey is PM going to do an article debunking the myths of why our border is being over run? I think they'll need elevendy billion experts for that one judging by their past work.

 
At 19 May, 2006 21:06, Blogger Ninja said...

the only way uou can believe this guy is if he has sources, which he is yet to show.

 
At 24 May, 2006 22:11, Blogger simuvac said...

You say the claim that the South Tower collapsed in 9.2 seconds is wrong, but the Kean Commission says the South Tower came down in 10 seconds (which may be the source of the discrepency). Even the more accurate figure of 15 seconds means explosives must have been used.

Perhaps most telling about the 9/11 Commission Report figure of 9.2 seconds is, as Jim Hoffman writes, "The Report states that the "South Tower collapsed in ten seconds," when it actually took about 15 seconds. While one might expect that the Commission would overstate rather than understate the collapse time, the fact that the Commission did not even consider a collapse time within one second of the vacuum free-fall time of 9.2 seconds a problem for the official explanation is evidence that the Commission would endorse that explanation no matter what the facts."

 
At 25 May, 2006 13:14, Blogger kazdoe said...

ok, so the plane wings could not penetrate the outer wings...then should we see them on the grass? Are you guys NSA?

 
At 25 May, 2006 13:18, Blogger kazdoe said...

come on people...building 7 was blown up by high explosives...L.S. said on record...did he forget...did they have what fireman they had left go into the building to set those explosives..if this can't be explained you are wasting your time. give it up.

 
At 31 May, 2006 18:39, Blogger insidejob said...

dear all, please take a look at my posts under sections 1 and 4 of "top lies." there are indeed a lot of lies in Loose Change. James and Pat are right about that, but 9-11 was definitely an inside job. the whole Flight 77 thing is a red herring to take our attention away from the real evidence and get us to argue with each other. Rumsfeld's "slip-up" about a "missile" was a calculated part of the hoax. Loose Change borrows heavily from the video In Plane Site, which was deliberate disinformation to distract us from the real evidence. someone needs to make a new video - a video that focuses on the real evidence (see my posts under section 1 and 4). I give a mass of evidence there, and I still have yet to research the 9-11 war games in depth, as well as the Secret Service's inexplicable violation of normal protocol.

 
At 31 May, 2006 18:48, Blogger insidejob said...

Those who push Loose Change ignore the real documentaries that are high quality: Denial Stops Here, The Truth and Lies of 9/11, The Great Conspiracy, and the footage from the 9/11 Citizens Commission hearing in New York City on September 9, 2004. Links to these and other films are at www.oilempire.us/movies.html

 
At 03 July, 2006 13:20, Blogger Swim said...

Oh, now I understand...because the people that perpetrated the deception told us they didn't AND they wrote it down, then when we see all the evidence we can just dismiss it because the GOVERNMENT says it isn't so. Example: the nosegear didn't punch the 16ft. (or 12 ft)hole into the third ring of the Pentagon, a landing gear did it. Oh. ok. Roll over, good boy James B. good Boy. Now, Sit! Stay...

 
At 15 July, 2006 13:58, Blogger stutteringprick said...

This structural integrity topic has me wondering about how maleable metal skyscraper will fall when it start to weaken.

Would the building fall down all at once, going straight down?

Or would it fall down a little at a time, and possibly sway sideways before it fell?

One of the things that this (or any blog) demonstrates is how impotent we are at finding the truth. Instead of conducting our own experiments, we wait for someone else to do the experiments for us.

 
At 18 July, 2006 10:20, Blogger Alliwantistruth said...

Do you have a thought of your own in your head? Seriously? I start reading your sources and its like you took a sentence or two from them and plastered them on your page as your thoughts. Form your own thoughts and ideas before you go running your mouth.

 
At 27 July, 2006 09:22, Blogger FTS715 said...

19. Claim: On February 23rd, 1991, a 38 story skyscraper in Philadelphia burned for more than 19 hours and spread over 8 floors. It did not collapse.

Truth: The firefighters fought the fire for 11 hours before they evacuated the building fearing a collapse. The building, which was never hit by an aircraft, was structurally unsound and later had to be demolished.

So a structrally unsound building was on fire for 19 hours and spread across 8 floors and didn't collapse yet a building that was only on fire for a little more than an hour and only spread on a few floors goes down?

 
At 30 July, 2006 18:52, Blogger Bob said...

Lets say your right about the steel being fatigued,and it started to bend or gave way.What about all the steel beems below the fire,they were not on fire,and they were not fatigued.Therefor the building would of just broke off,or fell side ways from the weight of the top portion pulling the base down with it.It surely would'nt of dropped like a rock.your splitting hairs about how long it took for the towers to fall,to me it does'nt matter.What does matter is HOW they fell,which is straight down,consistent with a controled demo.You argued a point in another THREAD you had,I think it was #1,where you said the hole in the Pent. was 90 feet not 16.I dont know where you get this 90 feet from,because you can clearly see the sign on the upper left side of the hole which gives the hole scale,and I can tell by that sign,there is no frikken way that hole is 90 feet,lol.I've been watching all these films online about 9/11 being an inside job,and figured I would go to some other blogs/sites to see the other side of the coin,and I have to tell you,if this is all thats out there your fighting a losing battle.Most of your sources are goverment,or newspapers,this is like asking the fox if he knows what happen to the chicken or hen house.I will say this to you,the truth will come out,but I doubt that you will even beleive that.One last question I have for you,one that I doubt you can answer,but raises MAJOR doubt in our goverment is,why doesnt the goverment release the video tapes at the pentagon?They cant say it would make us less safe with the war going on.I want to see these tapes!Good luck changing peoples mind with this junk you have posted!

 
At 30 July, 2006 22:45, Blogger James said...

Ok, there are a few logistical questions that I want answered by the CTs.

First off Alex Jones himself noted that it would take 1000 pounds of explosives to bring down the World Trade Centers? How exactly do you get 1000 pounds of explosives to the WTC without somebody noticing? You would need at least two truck drivers in on it to pull that off. You need to risk not having a homeless man or an employee finding out. Further more, you would need to plant it throughout the building. You think somebody might notice you carring 1000 lbs of fertilizer around the building?
Or if it happened at night, won't they kind of stand out. I doubt they usual stocked the WTC in the dark (especially with fall hours). (Hey what are those people doing stocking the WTC at 10pm?) And if they did, you need to shut them up somehow. How that is, I'm not sure.

 
At 06 August, 2006 09:39, Blogger Ryan (RL-WA) said...

Here is what I think. 9-11 never happened. In fact nothing exists outside of Lacey, Washington. The rest of the world is made up by the media, which is housed on College St. in Lacey.

This is based on logic and fact to a far greater extent than "Loose Change"

 
At 27 August, 2006 06:48, Blogger sunami said...

"How exactly do you get 1000 pounds of explosives to the WTC without somebody noticing? You would need at least two truck drivers in on it to pull that off."

Big deal! Do thousands of pounds of stocks/inventories never get loaded in offices/warehouses in buildings and towers? How would anyone know weather the boxes used are loaded with some inventory or explosives?

10 men carrying 100 pounds can carry boxes of explosives and store them in offices to be planted at strategic locations during night hours.

As it is the security of the towers was in the hands of Marvin Bush till 10th-sept-01. So there was not any chance of the explosives being detected by any potential bean-spiller.

 
At 06 September, 2006 22:26, Blogger skittles22 said...

that makes no sense everything loose change said has proof and most of that stuff has is visual proof. And u cant even have proof or have any links or anything. u r a bush lover bush is a weirdo dude im out....


burdur!!!!!!!!!

 
At 06 September, 2006 22:26, Blogger skittles22 said...

that makes no sense everything loose change said has proof and most of that stuff has is visual proof. And u cant even have proof or have any links or anything. u r a bush lover bush is a weirdo dude im out....


burdur!!!!!!!!!

 
At 08 September, 2006 19:26, Blogger Barbarian said...

It's also good to note that the Empire State building is a much tougher building than the WTC were. It is concrete floor and pillar throughout.

 
At 11 September, 2006 15:47, Blogger AYAV Webmaster said...

Ok screw all the other talk and everything. If it was a cruise missle or a military plane or whatever...WHAT ABOUT THE PEOPLE TO HAVE BEEN KILLED????
Some were well known and others just reular people...the government pay them off?

 
At 12 September, 2006 12:06, Blogger George Bruce said...

"...WHAT ABOUT THE PEOPLE TO HAVE BEEN KILLED????
Some were well known and others just reular people...the government pay them off?"


That is easy. They are all in suspended animation at a secret air force warehouse at Area 51.5. hehe

 
At 18 September, 2006 11:27, Blogger lenox7 said...

Sunami said:

"10 men carrying 100 pounds can carry boxes of explosives and store them in offices to be planted at strategic locations during night hours."

So what are the "strategic locations?" In closets? File cabinets?

In order for the charges to work, they would have to be placed against the actual steel supports which means ripping out walls - And no one noticed - sure

 
At 03 November, 2006 23:30, Blogger insidejob said...

there is a huge mountain of evidence that 9/11 was in inside job perpetrated by PNAC. it's obvious if you look at the facts. the terrorist were basically morons and were being watch by a program called "Able Danger." they were just patsies.

how could explosives and thermate have been planted? first of all if you look at the facts, it's obvious that WTC 1,2,and 7 were brought down by controlled demolition. second, Bush's cousin was the CEO of the company that "secured" the WTC, and Marvin Bush was a principal in the same company, and his contract was set to end on 9/10/01 (see Barbara Bush's memoirs). this company, Securicom, was installing a new "security system" in the years before the attacks. the creation of the cable network and locations for the thermate charges and explosives took years, but the actual placement of the charges only took a few days. the WTC had unprecedented powerdowns and evacuations in the days before the attacks. PNAC has been planning this fascist coup for years.

http://belowgroundsurface.org

 
At 15 January, 2007 22:09, Anonymous Anonymous said...

You know, I've been an antiwar activist, and I despise Bush, but you LC folks have more than change loose.

Sure, there is a conspiracy.

But it has nothing to do with the CIA or Marvin Bush (whoever) wiring two huge buildings (filled with hundreds and thousands of people even at nite, at least one of whom would probably have noticed something odd - dozens of guys carrying around loads of stuff at odd times - any time for that operation would have been unusual - and then lived to tell the tale, lived to be interviewed in 'Loose Change' - but there's no witness testifying to any such activity, nor any video.. hmmm..

Maybe there were no explosives?

Or what about the claim some of the hijackers are still alive? Okay, some dude said they were. Right.

You can't just say something like that and not produce one of the 'Magnificent 19' alive. If they are alive, and you believe it, you have to prove it. Beyond any shade of a doubt. But you can't because they are all dead, melted in the molten (yes, molten, melted by jet fuel you pitiful kooks) slag of those buildings.

You people are as contemptible as OJ, only a thousand times as pitiful. The killer is still out there. Sure, buddy, just like those hijackers are still alive, and a missile hit the Pentagon, and flight 73's passengers were all taken to Roswell and abducted by the CIA's alien branch. Yeh Wackjobs.

The list of idiocies advanced goes on. These guys here on this site - as much as I probably despise their politics - are doing yeomen's work. As they say, a 20% pith of truth does not a legal case make. So until you have it beyond a reasonable doubt (and there are 20 trillion more than reasonable doubts raised against Loose Change, and in favor of the assw*ds leading us- they definitely have nefarious ends, but they don't need to do what your febrile little nutwads imagine .. no, it's more obvious, boring and paradoxically subtle than all that..)

To put a point on it: given the gravity of the accusations, your insinuations alone ARN'T EVEN CLOSE TO BEING SUFFICENT!! You people are reckless paranoids. You cannot build a case this serious on innuendo. Your 'evidence' is virtually all hearsay, rumor or - in the far too few cases that there is actual physical support for the case, utterly circumstantial.

No prosecutor or (more importantly in this case) reputable reporter could ever touch this stuff. That's why the ‘dangerous insights’ are languishing here, being carped over by juvenile imbeciles, and not coincidently ignored by everyone else, instead (as you would expect, if you mow-rons were really onto something) of being annihilated along with the chumps who made Loose Change in a CIA torture cell, or shallow grave.

The reason the government doesn't care about you knuckleheads is that you are the perfect opposition. You're being used. And you discredit legitimate opposition by association.

Beavis & Butthead do Woodward & Bernstein. Funny stuff.

Thanks a lot. Thanks for making George look good by comparison, being such kookjobs.

The government may be complicit in 9/11 in its prior inaction, just as FDR in 1941 probably had a general idea of what was coming, and there probably was a strategic decision to let it come unopposed, and use the event to galvanize us. We're probably being similarly played now, on Iran.

It is indeed all about oil, Zionism & colonialism, Allah, Israel, the Mahdi & Armageddon. It's all in the open, y'all. The conspiracy is no secret.

Yeah. They probably did expect it, just like what's happening in Iraq now is probably part of the script. Break Iraq (the last significant Arab power opposed to Israel,) create conditions in which another series of attacks galvanizes support for an attack on Iran (the last remaining near threat.) Hilary or McCain, it's all the same. They’re all Zionists, wenthralled by the oil economy (just as most all of us are, filler up kids! Bless Standard Oil & John Jay) Whatever happens, the policy outline will not be any different.

So go change your bong water, and don't forget to register for the Selective Service, just to keep that Stafford Loan juice flowing, keep you in school for a sixth year. Just chill, no worries, man. It was all crazy sh**, an you ain't never gonna get it anyhow, no matter you try.

 
At 04 February, 2007 20:01, Blogger Haz-e said...

Just a quick question as i'm not sure exactly where I stand in regard to every single argument put forward in this case, how the hell do you get that many explosives into a building of that size without somebody noticing?

I mean seriously, do you guys even think about what you're saying?

I don't know how many pounds of C4 it would take to bring down either tower but I can assure you that it would be alot. Then they've got to get a HUGE team of structural engineers and demolitions experts to sneak into the building when NO ONE is there, excavate the walls, plant the explosives, re-seal the walls and get out without a single person noticing?

You don't think people would noticed a freshly painted wall in the morning?

You don't think SOMEONE would see them?

Common guys, i'm not debunking the entire CT, but get some better material than this.

 
At 05 February, 2007 09:20, Blogger SomebodysGotAScrewLoose said...

!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Haz-e !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Damn I get tired of people making claims without doing research. You obviously don’t know about the “unprecedented” power down of the twin towers the weekend before 9/11. You don’t know of all the work that Securacom did in the world trade center from 1996 - 2000, and who was director of Securacom from 1993 - 2000 Marvin Bush brother to pres. Bush, not only that but Wirt Walker III Bush’s cousin was CEO of Securacom from 1999 - 2002.

You people need to do some damn research instead of just making claims.

 
At 15 March, 2007 11:06, Blogger RAMS said...

I had tried to post this simple request on the Loose Change forum, but got no responses and was attacked for asking and then assailed for not addressing some qustion that was never posted by them. Odd, this.

This is the request, which requries no tech data but just a search. So, far nothing from them.
____________________

So, please address this: It requres no tech data at all. Just a search is all.

Others are watchng here. The point of proof is in your court to the following questions. Please address them. From anyone. They are also fair. They require no documentation, only a little work in each, since the net seems to be everyone's source, on both sides of the coin on this subject. I believe that is fair in any venue.

Please address these;

1. Please provide any link available, with any search engine, of trace explosive residue of any kind found on anything at the entire WTC complex related to the day of failure for all three structures. This way, no one is cornered or has to defend oneself on a personal level.

2. Please provide any link whereby any tall highrise was hit and survived an impact by a modern commerical jet liner at 500mph with an impact ratio translation of some 88,405 tons, plus fuel and all other combustibles combined.

Thank you in advance.


Robert A.M. Stephens, LLC ®
NASA Fine Art Documentation Program
Vision Motion Dynamic-FX-FX
http://www.behold-the-rage.com
________________________________
Have Jeep, Have Heart, Will Travel

 
At 23 March, 2007 17:52, Blogger Simon said...

how about the destruction of all the rubble of the wtc site so soon without full inspection why? i THINK this is against the law. why can't the government release the video they have just to put all this to rest, the reason for these CT is because of how shady they are acting about some simple questions you can't blame people for being suspicious.... a full power down a few days before the attacks there is nobody out there who can't just wonder....... MAYBE!!!!!!!!

 
At 24 March, 2007 13:19, Blogger johnrossi3 said...

#14.. When I was stationed at the Navy Manpower and Personnel Office (CNO-N12), my cubicle was on the outside windowed wall of the East side of Wing 5 (the outermost wing on the Pentagon side) of the Navy Annex which directly overlooks the site of the strike on the Pentagon. Given the trajectory of the flight path and the distances between the Annex and the Pentagon, one has to believe that anybody who happened to look out a window of Wing 5 would have the optimal view of the crash. In fact, the two accounts that I have been able to find from personnel in the Annex (and at least one of those from the Ballistic Missle Defense Office, which since 2000 occupies the space in which my office was located) identify the projectile as bearing American Airlines colors. One of the sources identified it as a 757 or an Airbus, the other a 737 (which at the speed it was moving is a reasonable error). Based on these two reports, I have little doubt that what was seen striking the Pentagon was an American Airlines 757. Nobody would have had a better view than somebody observing from Wing 5 of the Annex.

 
At 17 June, 2007 10:57, Blogger Ahmed said...

"12. Claim: No wreckage was found on the Pentagon lawn.

Truth: There are numerous pictures of plane wreckage, including those with the American Airlines paint scheme."

In none of those pictures did I see an AA paint scheme. And how exactly do you explain a WHOLE 747 plane turning into nothing but small plane parts? Did the rest of it magically melt? And do you realize that some of those parts aren't even the right size as a Boeing 747's parts? Good job.

 
At 24 June, 2007 01:02, Blogger Watergate said...

So, your entire "9-11 was an inside job" proof is that no 747 parts were found at the Pentagon? Loser -- it wasn't a 747. Also, there were identifiable parts like the landing gear that survived.

It's really, really stupid to think that there was some vast conspiracy merely because YOU don't understand some bit of evidence. The much more likely explanation is that you are misinformed or not very bright, not that there was some vast, secret conspiracy that NO ONE from the inside has ever leaked after all of these years.

 
At 09 July, 2007 18:37, Blogger William said...

The easiest way to place 1,000 pounds of explosives in a building is to replace all the fire extinguishers in the building with explosive filled fire extinguishers triggered by RF controlled detonators. If these fire extinguishers were centrally located near detrimental load bearing beams (which most are), the core integrity would be significantly be reduced... thus allowing for a controlled implosion. This is exactly the scenario I saw.

Fire extinguishers are seldom checked properly, most inspections are nothing more than weighing the extinguisher and examining the gauge on the extinguisher itself... never actually checking the pressure (which can also be faked).

Take a ten pound (empty) fire extinguisher and fill it with 14 & 1/2 pounds of magnesium laced explosives, and watch what happens when you detonate it... BIG BOOM!

 
At 09 July, 2007 20:21, Blogger knvb1123 said...

You guys. Calm down. Bush hired a local teenager to write shit on this blog. Both bush and whoever heshee he hired are dumbasses.

 
At 11 July, 2007 21:57, Blogger sure said...

I once worked in an office building of only about 20 medium sized levels. One of the floors had just been completely fitted out with dozens of desks and computers. A day later(broad daylight) 4-5 guys wearing overalls and pushing hand trolleys went to one of the higher floors and removed all of the newly delivered computers and loaded them into a truck parked on the street below. Plenty of people saw this happening but did not even think to question what they were doing or why they were there.

I am pretty sure that the US government, with all their resources and shady people associated with them, would be very capable of planting explosives in buildings of this size right under the nose of the occupants.

ah and one more word - sprinklers!?!?

 
At 26 July, 2007 02:31, Blogger Salvatore said...

SO..if Building 7 was leaning to one side, why the perfectly symetrical fall? We've all seen it. If the fire was in one corner, why didn't it topple to one side rather than all four corners of the building fall in perfect synch? Why is this even an arguement?

"If it's not done by the hand of God, it's a conspiracy", Jim Marrs

 
At 28 July, 2007 07:51, Blogger Smile and Say "Cheese" said...

Wow! This "screw" is realy loose. WTC7 was creaking??? BBC reported that it collapsed 20 minutes before it actually did. hmm...oh and is your stopwatch broken? The WTC 1 & 2 tower collapses should have taken up to 90 seconds to fall had the collapses really been the result of the "planes and fire".

 
At 19 August, 2007 07:49, Blogger SPCbrown said...

Could any of the people responding to James provide sources, or even credibility?
InsideJob, who are you? Where do you get your information? Are you an expert in this
field, and if so, how? Are you former intelligence of some sort (I mean that in a
professional sence) and if so, can we check your credentials in any way? I realize you
cited sources, and that is comendable...it is also why I appreciate your responses more so
than most of the other respondents. However, every statement you made is contenteionalbe
unless you prove yourself to be a person having a background facilitating training and/or
experience related to analyzing information of this nature. Untill you provide that
information, there is no reason for anyone here to assume anything contrary to you being
nothing more than a conspiracy theory propagandist. I hope that isn't the case because I've
enjoyed your responses the most. They seem to be the most well thought out.

Other than that, I see that James hase posted sources...I don't know if that is a
recent addition as I have only just found out about this blog. I only know that none of you
respondants, who claim some form of expertise or another, have cited any sources, or rather
any realevant sources, and none of you have established credibility. If you want to support
any of your arguements, make yourself credible first. I was an armorer at B co. 5-20 INF in
Ft. Lewis WA under the command of CPT Scott Maraner Naumann, who is now stationed at HQ 2-75
Ranger BTN at Ft. Lewis WA. It was my responsability in that position to know everything I
could about fire arms, especially military fire arms. I can tell you that cordite is still
used in making ammunition. If you want to check my references, call HQ 2-75 (the number can
be found at the Ft. Lewis directory, or on Army Knowledge Online.) ask for MAJ Naumann (he
has been promoted to Major since my discharge) and ask him if he infact had a soldier under
his command named SPC Brown at Battle 5-20. He should be able to confirm my presence there.
I am also willing to provide copies of my DD 214 (military discharge papers) to anyone who
provides e-mail addresses, or fax numbers. I am willing to do this because I am not afraid
to make myself credible. I only suggest calling my former CO (commanding officer) because
my DD 214 will not state that I was my unit's armorer, but my former CO can confirm that.

I don't know how you all claim that you cannot see the hole in the side of the Pentagon
through the smoke. I can see it just as well in Jame's photo as I could see it in the LC
video. I also showed that photo (Jame's) to a few other people who all said they could see
the hole "plain as day." That, of course, does not make that point of view all encompassing, but I do find it interseting that I can see it and so could every person I
showed it to, but none of you can.

I have read alot of technical jargon spit out on this blog, probably by people that
have no Idea what they are talking about, concerning the way that the WTC towers fell. I am
no engineer. I don't hold any degrees in physics, mathematics, engineering, or
architecture. But I do have common sense. Maybe the heat from the fires in the WTC towers
could not have caused the buildings to topple, but no one has even mentioned the impact from
the planes... The massive aircraft that even if they were made of a light weight matterial,
which LC even plainly states that we don't know what they are made of, must weigh an
increadible amount (I don't give a suggestion for weight because I don't prefer to venture a
guess). If you buy a three foot tall piece of five inch galvanised pipe and stand it on
end, it will stay that way untill something happens to nock it down. That fact remains true
even if you place a fourty-five pound weight at the top. I know this because I tried it. I
also dug that same peice of pipe into the ground a ways so that I could get it to actually
bend when I threw a soft-ball at it. I performed this experiment ten times. Five of those
times I even hammered a piece of rebar into the ground in the center of the pipe. I did
that to simulate the steel infrastructure of the WTC towers. Even with the rebar in place,
the pipe still bent 9 of those 10 times. The one time it didn't bend was when I hit the
pipe very close to the ground. It dented but didn't bend. What do you think happened with
that 45 pould weight that I left on the top of the pipe? Each time, it fell to the ground
and bent the pipe even worse during the fall. WHAT DOES THIS PROVE!? This proves that
impact plays a major part in the bending and toppling of a structure... which no one on this
blog has addressed concerning the WTC as far as I have read at this point in time. Now I realize that my model wasn't accurate to the WTC towers, but I still think that I got my
point across.

As far a building 7, I can plainly see, from the provided pictures, that the towers
fell more or less right on building 7. I also read the firemen's quotes about the building not looking steady, and shaking. I also read the provided sources of that information to my
satisfaction. So anyone who thinks contrary to that information needs to provide evidence to the contrary, not just conjecture, and they need to provide sources that the rest of us can examine for ourselves... I'm talking to you smile and say "cheese". Don't just say it,
prove it!

As far as the towers falling straight down, as if to suggest a controlled implosion...
In every video there ever was of the towers falling, they very obviously fell to the side.
debree was flung across an area spanning two city blocks. In the pictures and videos
provided in this initial argument, you can clearly see very large chunks of the towers
clearing building 7, which was further evinced by the damage it did to the building on the
other side, and by the massive pile of debree laying in the street on the other side of
building 7. It is very obvious that the towers did not, infact, fall straight down.

William, please enlighten me as to how you know where the fire extinguishers were place
in the WTC... much less anywhere else. Are you a fire marshal? I just happen to have taken
fire inspector courses since my release from the Army, which I don't have any proof of, but
what I'm about to tell you can easily be looked up online or told to you when you call any
local building inspector's office. Every one should read this, then look it up for
themselves. Fire extinguishers are most commonly place near any area that is centrally
located and/or any area that is considered a higher risk of fire. Using common sense,
explain to me where the importance of placing fire extinguishers near detrimental load bearing beams(that are nowhere near fire escapes and made of metal... a non-conbustable material) makes sense. I have worked in numerous office buildings, and have been inside
numerous others, and the most common place I see fire extinguishers are near stair wells. Now, if the load bearing beams of the WTC were located near the stairwells as well, then
prove it, don't just say it. Show me schematics... prove your credibility!

So Silverstein purchased a terrrorism policy on the WTC a little while prior to the 9-11 attacks. He had only been granted his lease less than two months prior to the attacks. Now, everyone knows about the terrorist bombing of the WTC in '93, which was far prior to Silverstein's lease. If I had more than 3 billion dollars riding on a structure that had already been attacked by terrorists, I'd purchase that policy as soon as possible too. The pollicy only covered 3.5 billion dollars by the way...Silverstein payed 3.25 billion dollars for the lease. That means that his policy would barely cover his loss, and I don't care who you are... If you had 3.25 billion dollars to blow on a couple of buildings... risking a meer 250 million dollar return on something as random as a terrorist attack shows a great deal of confidence in the fact that it won't happen again. (all information for this paragraph was obtained on wikipedia.org. If any of it is wrong please correct me... please cite sources)

It seems to me that alot of people on this blog are alot of talk. I'm not atempting to
call you all liers. I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm saying, prove it... justify
yourself... make yourself credible. You could all spit on me and tell me it's raining, but
untill I have a reason to listen to any of you, you are all wrong... or lying... or a
combination of the two.

What I am most confused about is: Are we all so bored and desperate that we have to
concoct a conspiracy about everything. I even read a conspiracy about Big Bird once, and it terrifies me that the person who wrote the Big Bird theory could very well be insidejob, or william, or smile and say "cheese". You are all propagandists and some of you are very talented, but that is all any of you are untill you prove your credibility. None of you have done that so far except for James who clearly provided numerous sources for his arguments. The worst part is that you are all attacking James' credibilty and he's the only one on this blog with direct, verifiable evidence that requires no assessment or analysis. His evidence has no conjecture. He has provided it as is, and at face value.

I read a manuscript once about how the Holocaust never happened, and that it would have
been physically impossible. That argument was very convincing, but it isn't true. The Loose Change conspiracy theory is very convincing, but it isn't true. All of you know it...
you must. Any of you could use common sense to figure it out. I know that life is boaring,
and I know that you all hate the USA, but don't conjure up stories about a tragic event that
killed thousands of innocent civilians, just so you can have something to make your life
more exciting.

 
At 20 September, 2007 10:41, Blogger samantha21916 said...

Are U saying that the hole was NOT 16 feet? do the measurements before you say that...the engine was not from a rolls royce...the hole was too damn small for a plane..and of all the hundres of cameras they much have at the pentagon..in the trees..bushes...roofs..pointed directly where the "plane" hit..then why not release the tape? they only realsed 2 videos and there is no plane in either..if they have all this video..why not release it and put the whole debate to rest? Ya know why..cuz there was no 747..this was an inside job. Larry Silvertine said they "pulled it".(building 7). 9/11 commision report makes no mention of it..why? cant just rig a building with explosives in a few hours..this took prior planning. For those towers to collapse..it had to be from the bottom..and there WERE explosions heard in the basement..Multiple..this dude needs to do his research. Seriously.

P.S. The buildings were FILLED with asbestos...thats another reason why they decited to take um down...it was too expensive to do removal floor by floor and building 7's occupants were mostly gove'ment. It destroryed evidence in multiple fraud cases.

 
At 28 October, 2007 15:27, Blogger evian said...

t the facts presented in loose change ye said that in loose change they say that a b-52 bomber hit the empire estate building when if you actually took the time to watch the documentary and take in the obvious facts that they present they did say that it was actually a b-25 bomber as ye also suggested.This is such a small incompatent dig at loose change i dont even no was it worth my while pointing this blatent lie out.Everyone knows what ye are trying to do which is to cover up the cover up and if ye are to do this at least have a viable and concrete case before you start taking a dig at the real facts..another thing is "a picture tells a thousand words"and iam still a waiting any real pictures or video footage of your claim to back up your obsurd comments..the fact that this is called screw loose change for me further demeanors your position and accountability as a person or a site that is presenting "facts"....

 
At 28 October, 2007 15:31, Blogger evian said...

this site is an absolute joke ye have posted blatent lies about the facts presented in loose change ye said that in loose change they say that a b-52 bomber hit the empire estate building when if you actually took the time to watch the documentary and take in the obvious facts that they present they did say that it was actually a b-25 bomber as ye also suggested.This is such a small incompatent dig at loose change i dont even no was it worth my while pointing this blatent lie out.Everyone knows what ye are trying to do which is to cover up the cover up and if ye are to do this at least have a viable and concrete case before you start taking a dig at the real facts..another thing is "a picture tells a thousand words"and iam still a waiting any real pictures or video footage of your claim to back up your obsurd comments..the fact that this is called screw loose change for me further demeanors your position and accountability as a person or a site that is presenting "facts"....

 
At 07 November, 2007 19:29, Blogger TherecanbeonlyOne said...

I have spent my entire career in construction, Base building construction and interior renovations. What I have seen and done can be verified by most anyone who works in an office building. First, most quality contractors will enter a building to do renovations WHEN NOBODY IS THERE! The dust and paint "fumes" can cause the regular occupant of the office to become "ill". Latex paint fumes (it is uncommon to use an oil based paint in an office building) dissipate quickly (within hours of application) Further, paint "fumes" mix with the combined recirculated air and fresh air(20%) within the buildings HVAC system. Further, most offices are painted with shades of white, which dry to the touch within 30 minutes. The link is for HVAC building code rule of thumb for those interested.
http://books.google.com/books?id=2nMw5-3VvdUC&dq=hvac+building+codes&pg=PA2&ots=qNX4RXIvO3&sig=yM1Uve7ISMTuj39TtTeQt7seL_8&prev=http://www.google.com/search%3Fhl%3Den%26q%3Dhvac%2Bbuilding%2Bcodes&sa=X&oi=print&ct=result&cd=3&cad=legacy#PPA84,M1that a minimum
I mention this in response to let those reading this blog that it is possible and common practice for a quality contractor to enter a building and renovate small portions with no one even noticing. We are paid very well to be "ghosts". If you go to a hardware store or contractor supply store you will find a product called Easysand. This comes in a variety of "set" times ranging from 5, 20, 45, 90 and 120 minutes. It takes a very talented person (myself included) to use Easysand 5. But the end result is you can open a piece of drywall around a column (most colums are framed with drywall and metal stud) insert anything (we mainly insert fire rated plywood so occupants can attach a 60" plasma screen to the wall), use the piece of drywall removed to cover the opening; patch, sand, skim, paint AND clean up all within 3 hours. And get paid for eight. As far as fire extinguisher placement, The rule of thumb is placing them near a stairwell (these are structural, but not enough to take down a building). However, there is one thing that I've seen no mention of in this blog. Indoor plants are usually placed in elevator lobbies (the structural core of WTC). It would be very easy to place 10+ lbs of explosives into the planter. And these do get changed very regularly. Those who work in a high class office building should know this. So for those that are CT's the plants are for you, for those who doubt the veracity of workers doing work in a building at night, well, its common practice especially in a building that generates high rents. Work usually done at night includes electrical wiring, cabling, plumbing, carpet changing, regular cleaning, etc. and yes even changing out the plants.

 
At 21 November, 2007 13:47, Blogger I Stand With Israel said...

these liberal whores uses the same bs that the kkk and the aryan nation use that the jews/bush and space aliens did 9/11 got to wonder if the they both have the same agenda ie aid their neonazi muslim socialis allies

 
At 08 March, 2008 08:19, Blogger Ladalang said...

read your site and I'm sorry you've proven nothing. You make yourselves look unwise and uneducated. You are merely arguing to argue and have no real proof that movie lied about anything. I can't tell if you're truly ignorant or a government plant. Who could be so stupid?

 
At 31 March, 2008 13:12, Blogger pfunkity1 said...

Yes it was a B-25 not a B-52, typo so what! But that fact is that now you are distorting history! The B-25 hit the 79th creating a 18 foot by 20 foot hole and caused fires down to the 75th floor. Source http://history1900s.about.com/od/1940s/a/empirecrash.html

Note: One engine exited the far side of the building landing on a neighboring building while the other fell into an elevator shaft causing a fire in the basement!

 
At 02 April, 2008 01:43, Blogger Elephant said...

How many people would be required to execute the 9/11 attacks, controlled demolitions, disposing of passenger laden planes, and other events that would need to take place to support the government conspiracy theory? I would conservatively estimate a few hundred. Does a conspiracy theorist really beleive such an enourmous cast could be assembled covertly without alerting somebody not especially keen on the idea of murdering their own countrymen? Is your average CT familiar with the zealous patriotism that a CIA/Secret Service acolyte is typically imbued with?

This concept of a huge covert malevolent force(with deep pockets or itchy trigger fingers to pay off or kill the innocents who discover their dark secret) is the best argument anyone can put forward for the acceptance of the official story. It is implausible that such an operation could be planned and executed with all the people that would be required to hate their countrymen so much.

 
At 02 April, 2008 05:43, Blogger Ladalang said...

It would only require just one governmental entity like the CIA or the FBI.

 
At 09 April, 2008 21:28, Blogger toyman502003 said...

Claim: The only damage to the outer wall of the Pentagon was a single hole, no more than 16 feet in diameter.

Truth: The hole was approximately 90 feet wide. The 16 foot measurement was only achieved by looking at pictures where the rest of the hole was obscured by smoke and foam from the firefighters.

13. Claim: A 16 foot hole was punched in the C ring of the Pentagon by the airplane’s soft carbon fiber nose.

Truth: It was a 12 foot hole, and it was made by the much more resilient nose landing gear.

How is this possible when you state that in the first stanza that it was a 90 foot hole. So what you're trying to say is that this hole is a shape-shifter.

 
At 26 April, 2008 22:06, Blogger GoP-DoE said...

Hopefully someone reads this. First lets start of saying this was planned by the goverment or who ever you want. They took the years to plan this plant demolitions and get planes to fly into these buildings. Then they are going to over look that people will find out that a building should take a certain amount of time (90 seconds was it?) to fall down from fire/crash dmg. And forget to have another plane hit the other buildings. Most likely not. And they got planes for the buildings but they decide to say F*ck it for the pentagon. Yeah, that makes sense.

Or maybe they did those mess ups on purpose as a form of disinformation so we don't pay attention to things that really matter..

We may also just be letting our mind make sh*t up.

But thats just me.

And toy, I belive he is refering to the 'inner' wall...

 
At 26 April, 2008 22:11, Blogger GoP-DoE said...

I have some more ideas. Also, This could have been done by someone other then our government to make it look like they did it so our country would tear itself apart.

Or, for those of you that think our goverment wants more control. Maybe it was done by them so people would 'stand up' against them so they could declare a state of emergancey and take full control.

Maybe I think of some more ideas.

 
At 11 June, 2008 13:35, Blogger thirdcoastcollin said...

your claim about WTC7

if it was brought down by "falling debris" why werent other buildings brought down by falling debri too?

 
At 06 October, 2008 11:49, Blogger Russ said...

Where are the 12 ton engines? I didnt see them in any of the pictures of the pentagon? I mean 12 TONS of metal IS alot. Why cant we see any of the other 84 videos that captured this on film? I would just like some answers to my questions. I read through the 911 Commision Report and didnt see any answers there?

 
At 09 January, 2009 21:34, Blogger gonvy056 said...

Seriously, I've heard about the loose change crap before but I never really bothered to look it up. I kind of just stumbled across this blog and the vast amount of rediculous, unfounded, unpatriotic, far-left, idiototic, I wanna go hug a f*ing tree, comments that have been posted here. Jesus people, what happened to us? Anit-war this and anti-Bush that, Grow the F*ck up. Neither loose change or screw loose change can prove or disprove sh*t. I just don't understand how people can grow up thinking that this world is nothing but a field full of daisies for you hippie dumba**es to sniff all day. This is the real world people, shit happens, war happens, people die, and once apon a time; Americans supported their country, armed forces and government. Stop trying to analyze this sh*t when you guys know damn well that you are just some joe blow with absolutley no credentials to speak of and you're sitting on your ass in front of your computer waiting for your world of warcraft clan to meet up for a narly raid. Grow up, get real, read a book on politics, war, history, and support the heros who protect your sorry asses. Goodnight :)

 
At 19 January, 2009 15:02, Blogger thesnook said...

Loose change is Liberal Left Wing trash made by a Film school reject....Take another bong hit Buddie...I guess three kids from New York have it all figured out...don't listen to the experts on the history channel who showed exactly how the building fell or all the eyewitness accounts...Lets listen to some Pot smoking Tree hugging nut jobs with a Liberal Agenda...Please all you Liberals out there just move to China or Russia cause that's were you belong...you are so Anti-American is sicking...Hey maybe Bigfoot ran into the twin towers with a bomb on his back while the tooth ferry flew into the building above...You losers are a disgrace to this country and the Men and Woman that protect it....Blows me away people believe this crap.....

 
At 10 February, 2009 21:27, Blogger oooorgle said...

Watch (for free) over 80 documentaries on 9/11 along with a multitude of news articles and eyewitness interviews. Then decide for yourself.

http://www.oooorgle.com/wordpress

 
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At 15 July, 2009 10:30, Blogger globalization said...

this whole blog is bs. more than half of your sources cite other web pages claiming to have debunked myths. youre in the same boat as us believers dude. all you can go by is what you THINK. youll NEVER know, and neither will we.

 
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At 04 August, 2010 22:30, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"19. Claim: On February 23rd, 1991, a 38 story skyscraper in Philadelphia burned for more than 19 hours and spread over 8 floors. It did not collapse.

Truth: The firefighters fought the fire for 11 hours before they evacuated the building fearing a collapse. The building, which was never hit by an aircraft, was structurally unsound and later had to be demolished."

-this building wasnt demolished until 1999 after the owners being sued to do something about the empty building. it stood for about 9 years before coming down.

 
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At 22 March, 2011 20:27, Blogger Percy said...

17. Claim: WTC 7, a 47 story office building 300 feet away from the North Tower, suddenly collapsed for no reason.

Truth: There was nothing sudden about it. The building was hit by falling debris from one of the towers, was missing much of one corner, had a huge hole in the middle and was on fire for hours. The building had started leaning and making creaking....


So why the hell didn't it fall on it's side? Furthermore, what about those claims that the CIA had lost many of it's " Files" on corporate fraud that where housed in Building 7.

I step further, why did this guy ( see video) claim to have seen and heard explosion and why is he dead?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XOK-r80nr8&feature=channel_video_title

 
At 22 March, 2011 22:55, Blogger pieman__2 said...

In trying to prove a point, one often embellishes and so one losses credibility. I will therefore just try to sick to the basics…

As I watched the live CNN broadcast way back when this all happened, the following questions immediately started up in my mind:
1) Why did all 3 the WTC buildings collapse symmetrically after suffering unbalanced damage? The odds of that happening to three buildings on the same day is like a gazillion to one.
See: http://www.scholarsfor911truth.org/WhyIndeedDidtheWorldTradeCenterBuildingsCompletelyCollapse.pdf
2)Where did the Pentagon plane go? – The Twin Tower planes left clear silhouettes on the buildings. Regardless of the debate about the size of the hole, there is no evidence of wings impacting the building and that is where the fuel is stored!!!! If they did not penetrate the building, all the burning fuel should be lying on the grass along with the wreckage of the wings or against the outside wall. Then I learnt that the impact was at an angle. That means that a plane with a 125 foot wingspan would make a 150 foot + impact mark!!!! From my Oval track experience, I also know that the wings would be more likely to bounce back from a reinforced wall at an angle and should have ended up to the left of the fire trucks, with a wide spread fire.
3)What has happened since 911??? Well, it gave Bush the mandate to look for foreign threats and here is how that ended:
From: http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1580119/bush-administration-lied-935-times-about-iraq-before-invasion-study.jhtml “Bush Administration Lied 935 Times About Iraq Before Invasion”
and
From: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11050587 “The death of Iraq weapons expert David Kelly was a "textbook case" of suicide, according to the pathologist who performed the post-mortem examination.”

Whistle blowers always commit suicide, just before they can prove their point.

It would be no problem for them to get whatever reports they needed on 911, as they did with Iraq.

 

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