Thursday, February 22, 2007

Barrett & Gold Discuss Bigotry and Holocaust Denial

Ignoring the first rule of holes, Kevin Barrett post this exchange with Jon Gold on his MUJCA website. Most of this exchange leaves you shaking your head.


From: Kevin Barrett khidria@merr.com

That's why the 9/11 scriptwriters wrote in "stewardess stabbings" -- they wanted to trigger the lynch-mob reflex by planting a fantasy of swarthy darked-skinned ay-rabs violently penetrating innocent American (i.e. white) womanhood all part of the attempt to psychologically condition people into thinking it's okay to kill and torture arabs and muslims

Bringing in the "white womanhood" issue in regards to the "stewardess stabbings" is an interesting approach, especially considering the 2 flight attendants involved, who are most known to the public, due to their phone calls being recorded (or scripted as Barrett would argue) are CeeCee Lyles and Betty Ong.




















CeeCee Lyles





















Betty Ong

Later in the exchange Gold argues for the big tent approach to 9/11 truth:

I do not believe Eric William's, Eric Hufschmid's, Christopher Bollyn's, etc... "work" should be apart of the 9/11 Truth Movement.

Well, I don't like racism or bigotry of any kind. I kicked Kaminski off my show for bad-mouthing Jews, and would do the same for anyone else. But that doesn't mean that nothing Kaminski writes has any value, any more than Rabbi Lerner's pride that his son fought with the IDF (to a Muslim, that's like being proud your son was in the SS) invalidates his good work. America's greatest humorist, H.L. Mencken, was an anti-Semite, as were TS Eliot and Ezra Pound, while almost all white Americans in the 19th century, and most in the 20th, were racists. For that matter, lots of wonderful, accomplished Jews have been prejudiced against goys. Lots of people have unfortunate prejudices and loonie ideas about one topic, while having something valuable to say about another topic. Exactly when someone's bigotry crosses the line to the point that you have to shun them entirely is a judgment call. I don't know enough about any of these three guys to be sure--though Williams' book sounds pretty dubious, and Hufschmid's remarks about Jews on one occasion were way over the top. But Hufschmid did do a great book and an excellent video, and Bollyn seems to have done some good journalism. I say let's try to speak the truth fearlessly, blast any bigots when they express their bigotry, but celebrate good work even when it's done by bigoted people. Heck, if I had to shun every anti-Arab, anti-Muslim bigot, there'd be hardly anybody in this country left to talk to. I'd have to cancel all my mainstream media interviews--and where would I be without Hannity and O'Reilly ; )

See you in Arizona.

Jon


Yeah, OK. See you in Arizona.

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27 Comments:

At 22 February, 2007 16:34, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Anyone still driving their Ford Motor vehicle?

 
At 22 February, 2007 17:13, Blogger default.xbe said...

why, are fords zionist/globalists now, or are they beign shut down by the globalists?

 
At 22 February, 2007 18:05, Blogger ConsDemo said...

Well, I don't like racism or bigotry of any kind.

This shithead expresses plenty of anti-American bigotry, so she doesn't have much room to talk.

 
At 22 February, 2007 18:26, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Default,
No, Adolf Hitler was a great admirer of Henry Ford. Henry Ford of course was a notorious anti-Semite and xenophobe.

The logic follows that if you drive a Ford, then you must be anti-semite.

As the deniers state, the Truth Movement has members who believe in holocaust denial then it follows that 9/11 Truth denies the holocaust. Of course a huge logical fallacy in both cases. I thought I might use Ford fallacy to show the fallacy in thought trying to link 9/11 Truth with holocaust denial.

Which is just another denier/debunker smear tactic that the uniformed may easily fall prey to unless shown the lies of debunkers.

 
At 22 February, 2007 19:07, Blogger shawn said...

Which is just another denier/debunker smear tactic that the uniformed may easily fall prey to unless shown the lies of debunkers.

You, or any other Truther, calling anyone uninformed is laughable.

Ownership of a vehicle =/= membership to an ideology/movement.

Your point was correct, but your analogy was so awful I don't know what possessed you to think it was good.

9/11 denial and Holocaust denial are identical in thought process, which is besides the point here. You, and all other Truthers, should denounce allowing Holocaust deniers to be involved in the movement. I certainly would be agreeing with Pat and James and working with them to weed out the undesirable elements of the movement.

Oh I know why you don't do that - you can't agree with anything the skeptics/debunkers say - always have to side with the Truthers no matter what. Watch out for the cliff, lemming.

 
At 22 February, 2007 19:08, Blogger shawn said...

hahahah just noticed you called us deniers.

I wish you morons would know which terms go with who - you're the deniers, we're the skeptics. Stop playing Orwell.

 
At 22 February, 2007 19:15, Blogger telescopemerc said...

The logic follows that if you drive a Ford, then you must be anti-semite.

So what does it mean if I drive a Volkswagon?

 
At 22 February, 2007 19:47, Blogger shawn said...

So what does it mean if I drive a Volkswagon?

Hitler made the original design that became the first VW, so you're pretty much Satan.

 
At 22 February, 2007 20:16, Blogger The Reverend Schmitt., FCD. said...

Swing Dangler said:


Which is just another denier/debunker smear tactic that the uniformed may easily fall prey to unless shown the lies of debunkers.


No wait, hang on, you personally parroted the claims of Holocaust deniers - even denied it yourself - in another comments section.

 
At 22 February, 2007 22:46, Blogger Sword of Truth said...

"...any more than Rabbi Lerner's pride that his son fought with the IDF (to a Muslim, that's like being proud your son was in the SS) invalidates his good work..."

We're getting to the point where we're going to start handing out awards for the most outrageously anti-semitic twoofer statement of the week.

I don't think any of the twoofers are going to top this one for at least 7 days. =P

 
At 22 February, 2007 23:02, Blogger Alex said...

We already know swing dumpster is a holocaust denier, so there's no point debating him on this topic.

Hey swingie, have you at least figured out a way to prove that you're not a child molester?

 
At 23 February, 2007 06:09, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Oh I know why you don't do that - you can't agree with anything the skeptics/debunkers say

Well actually Shawn, that is incorrect. I do not believe Larry S. admitted on live television that WTC 7 was pulled through CD. Many folks do. Before visiting this blog, I did. I did some research and changed my mind thanks to some of the information found here. The problem is, you can't do that with anything regarding the events of that day.

Your point was correct, but your analogy was so awful I don't know what possessed you to think it was good.

Do you have a better one that would prove my point?

Reverand, if you read the post, I was arguing with James what was in Willams book and how James cherrypicked the book as he and others accuse troofers of doing. Because I argued what was in his book and the sources it does not follow that I believe what is in his book. In the world of debating and arguing, that is called playing the devil's advocate. I even stated I do not deny the holocaust. Did you even read the post? Nice try though. Kudos for the effort!
Now did you do that to deceive the readers or was it a error?

If it was an error, I await forever for your appology or retraction.

If it was to deceive the readers, Thou Shall Not lie, reverand!

AlexWe all know you are a lying coward as well and thanks for proving it yet again. Your child molester arguement was proven wrong on that thread. Can you prove your serving you country like the Canadian heroes in Afghanistan?

 
At 23 February, 2007 06:10, Blogger Pepik said...

"Which is just another denier/debunker smear tactic that the uniformed may easily fall prey to unless shown the lies of debunkers."

Not really. The thing is, troofers and holocaust deniers are both quite rare animals. Yet they seem to share the same habitats, have many behavioural patterns in common, and have similarly underdeveloped brains. So although they are not the same species, they appear to be closely related.

 
At 23 February, 2007 06:12, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Hitler made the original design that became the first VW, so you're pretty much Satan.

Hitler was auto-moblie designer now, Shawn? No, Hitler sketched the general shape of the car. Hitler gave his design to the head of Daimler-Benz, Jakob Werlin, and stressed its importance. "Take it with you and speak with people who understand more about it than I do. But don't forget it. I want to hear from you soon, about the technical details."
I don't think that classifies him as an auto-mobile designer, but rather an artist.

 
At 23 February, 2007 06:15, Blogger Swing Dangler said...

Pepik How developed is the brain of a typical person working in the banking industry?

 
At 23 February, 2007 06:15, Blogger Alex said...

Do tell us more about your love-affair with Hitler.

 
At 23 February, 2007 07:26, Blogger CHF said...

Your child molester arguement was proven wrong on that thread.

If it's wrong then so is your prove-a-negative logic, Swing. We were copying YOU, remember?

Here's a challenge, Swing: log in and post at JREF.

You game?

 
At 23 February, 2007 11:51, Blogger Mark said...

Hufschmid did a great book and Bollyn has done some great reporting?

Jon Gold: Supermoron.

 
At 23 February, 2007 11:54, Blogger Mark said...

swing dangler said...
"As the deniers state, the Truth Movement has members who believe in holocaust denial then it follows that 9/11 Truth denies the holocaust."

Name the 9/11 debunkers who've said that, or retract your statement.

That's how it's done by adults. Are you an adult or a baby?

 
At 23 February, 2007 14:16, Blogger shawn said...

Hitler was auto-moblie designer now, Shawn? No, Hitler sketched the general shape of the car. Hitler gave his design to the head of Daimler-Benz, Jakob Werlin, and stressed its importance.

Wow, tell me something I don't know, swing.

Jokes don't tend to work if they're not succinct.

 
At 24 February, 2007 07:12, Blogger CHF said...

I do not believe Larry S. admitted on live television that WTC 7 was pulled through CD. Many folks do. Before visiting this blog, I did.

Only a fucking moron would have EVER believed something so stupid.

The fact that Swing needed research is telling.

 
At 24 February, 2007 09:01, Blogger 911_truthiness said...

AS if truthers are doing anything as useful as building cars.

These people sell ideas and the fact there can be so easily fooled by the holocaust denial people show a lack of ability to think.

So why should I buy their ideas on 911.

 
At 24 February, 2007 09:06, Blogger Los Alamos 9/11 Truth said...

One picture is worth a thousand words ...

Get your ostrich heads out of the sand and take a look...

http://losalamos911truth.blogspot.com/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EadoxWXpgY

 
At 24 February, 2007 09:27, Blogger CHF said...

Hey dumbass,

why would there be "squibs" on the top of the building in a bottom-up collapse?

First you clowns talk about "basement" bombs in a top-down collapse and now it's top-section bombs in a bottom-up collapse.

You folks seriously need some demolition knowledge.

 
At 24 February, 2007 09:34, Blogger CHF said...

Oh and your "squibs" show up AFTER the collapse has started.

So tell me the point of blowing charges on the top floors after the collapse has started from the bottom.

 
At 24 February, 2007 13:59, Blogger The Reverend Schmitt., FCD. said...

Swing Dangler said:

Reverand, if you read the post, I was arguing with James what was in Willams book and how James cherrypicked the book as he and others accuse troofers of doing. Because I argued what was in his book and the sources it does not follow that I believe what is in his book.


It does when you claim that he cherry picked the data to make his own set of claims seem more accurate, then go on to list a number of 'sources' (and a few claims):

Many other sources you forgot to mention that William's cite's in his book to support his thesis which of course I knew you would not mention at all. You sir are becoming quite the master at propaganda.

All of which, much like all the others James listed, have absolutely no credibility and are long debunked (see Shawn, der bruno, nick Terry et al's responses). If you think the arguments you're listing have as little credibility as all the other rubbish which James points to then I thoroughly fail to see why you'd mention them to counter his apparently specious scholarship. Unless you're seriously arguing that he misled his readers because he failed to mention that even more of Williams' scholarship is pathetic and shoddy? Is that really your argument your friend?

Really?

Thus, we can see you're a liar on top of being a Holocaust denier. Isn't that interesting? Absolutely fascinating I'd say.

I even stated I do not deny the holocaust.

As do most Holocaust deniers. Not sure why you think I'd take your claims about your own actions over your own actions.

Did you even read the post?

Yes, went on to counter it. As did a few other posters. It was fun and all, I've honestly missed annihilating your kind.

The word is 'reverend' incidentally.

 
At 02 March, 2007 11:59, Blogger Jon Gold said...

Everything from...

Well, I don't like racism or bigotry of any kind. to and where would I be without Hannity and O'Reilly ; )

Is not me.

A lie? A misrepresentation?

 

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