Thursday, April 01, 2010

Why The Chain of Custody Matters

Over in the thread at Truth Move, Victoria Ashley says:

John, the chain of custody issue is cooked up by the debunkers. The handling of the samples was done no differently then typical scientific studies, and much research out there on the dust uses the same methods and no police were involved. The USGS did not have police escorts, the UC Davis researchers did not get dust from the police, etc. That is just not done in scientific studies, which is what this is. In fact, most studies never say anything about how the dust was obtained, only where it was found.


And in a sense, she's right. Nobody cares where the USGS or the EPA (which she mentions later) got their samples. But there's a crucial difference here. The chain of custody matters precisely because the Troofers are claiming this is evidence that nanothermite was used to bring down the towers. Presumably they would like to use this as evidence in a court of law, which has very strict standards for chain of custody.

She BSes a bit here:
John, yes, it looks like the French researcher did not have the equipment to do the crucial calorimetry test so could not be considered to have done a significant independent analysis. Thanks for reminding me about him, I'd forgotten what the issues were about his attempt to analyze the samples.

Let's reiterate what he said:

The chips do not react even when heated to 900 degrees C. He doesn't need a calorimeter to measure that. BTW, although he mostly found red chips instead of red and gray ones, that doesn't matter, because Jones claimed that it was the red portion that showed the thermitic reaction.

16 Comments:

At 01 April, 2010 12:40, Anonymous Willy Rod's Stillborn Child said...

There were bombs in the basement.

 
At 01 April, 2010 13:11, Blogger Lazarus Long said...

"...my samples were deactivated to prevent my independendent corroboration of a crucial proof"

Because......they knew that some nut was going to get ahold of some randome sample of dust from to collaspe of a 110 story building and "they" knew exactly what random sample to "deactivate".

Gotcha.

 
At 01 April, 2010 13:59, Blogger Billman said...

Chain of custody is important to know in case someone has deliberatly sabotaged the samples, as in the case of what this retard claims happened to his sample. Well, dipshit, if you knew the fucking chain of custody, you could pinpoint who possibly sabotaged your sample, couldnt you?

 
At 01 April, 2010 14:09, Blogger Billman said...

Its obvious the troof movement relishes the fact that there is no chain of custody for Jones's samples. That way they can claim shit like: "Uh.. well... the sample.. was.. DEACTIVATED! (Yeah, that works).. by.. by.. THEM!" when REAL science debunks their bullshit that they can't back up.

Because, its obvouis this other independent person who agreed to test the samples so Jones would have some corraboration for his theory, yet it turned out negative, now had invent a reason why the samples didn't do what Jones claimed, yet can still be used as proof of an inside jobby job!

So there you have it, troofers. All of your evidence is fictional and invented on the spot.

 
At 01 April, 2010 14:16, Blogger Billman said...

Plus, Arhoolie still has yet to show me why the spectrograph for thermite in Jones's paper matches kaolinite's spectrograph for paint primer... but not the spectograph for thermite in any other science journal or spectrograph reference.

So really, who's the "cult" here? The people checking the facts (debunkers) or the people making them up (troofers)?

 
At 01 April, 2010 15:59, Blogger Triterope said...

Presumably they would like to use this as evidence in a court of law, which has very strict standards for chain of custody.

As does peer review. Which is one of many reasons why Richard Gage and Steven Jones will never submit to it.

 
At 01 April, 2010 17:24, Blogger James B. said...

Well obviously the nanothermite was deactivated by the nuclear explosions. Duh, do we really need to keep explaining this to you guys?

 
At 01 April, 2010 23:55, Blogger TV said...

I do love it when he claims the chain of custody doesn't matter when defending an article claiming the possibility this sample was tampered with.

 
At 02 April, 2010 21:11, Anonymous Anonymous said...

What did Mark Basile find though? Funny, again no mention of that in this piece.

It's as if Basile doesn't exist, but Couannier does.

 
At 05 April, 2010 12:22, Anonymous Sackcloth Crashes said...

Yes,Elmer and Homer,it's all a devious conspiracy by anti-American "truthers" to plant evidence of explosives in 6 different samples of World Trade dust.Sackdoily was right the whole time.Damn!! Another conspiracy unearthed by the mind blowing genius of the Debunker Cult!! Kudos,fellas!

 
At 07 April, 2010 00:16, Anonymous Roman Craig said...

The self-loathing jew spews...Yes,Elmer and Homer,it's all a devious conspiracy by anti-American "truthers" to plant evidence of explosives in 6 different samples of World Trade dust.Sackdoily was right the whole time.Damn!! Another conspiracy unearthed by the mind blowing genius of the Debunker Cult!! Kudos,fellas!

And the sane world shakes it's head and wonders what the fuck happened to this piece of shit early in life...

 
At 07 April, 2010 10:34, Anonymous Arhoolie the Cyber-Hero said...

Someone tell Captain Queeg I ain't a Jew.The man seems to have a weird obsession with Jews,don't he?!?

 
At 13 April, 2010 22:56, Blogger GuitarBill said...

Arsehoolie does the work of three men: Moe, Larry, and Curly.

 
At 14 April, 2010 12:14, Anonymous GuitarShemp Howard said...

Even Moe,Curley and Larry know that Israel has nuclear weapons.

 
At 14 April, 2010 19:56, Blogger GuitarBill said...

And your proof is what?

Your opinion and speculation?

When will you learn, Arsehoolie, that opinion and speculation are not evidence?

 
At 15 April, 2010 15:48, Anonymous "Guitar Shrill" Slicer said...

You're like the knight in "Monty Python and the Holy Grail"!! You've been chopped down,utterly decimated and rendered a kook,yet you still fight on.It's really rather touching.

 

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